OESFD Vs Top Set

[JacksonTens]

I saw this hand scoping my B&M yesterday.
If you had K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] on a

5 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] board

would you value raise infinately, even though you knew your opponent had 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Would it change if you had the K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]???

What if the roles were reversed???

JT [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

i punched that into pokerstove and found out that KK has a 57% edge. so hell yeah im 10-betting that flop if given the possibility.
a OESFD kicks in about 56% (dont remember the exact number) but the set has redraws to beat the other draw.

[kross]

Yes, if there's no cap heads-up, I raise until I run out of chips. You're a favorite over his 15 outs. Even if he hits his 15 outer, you have a 10-out redraw (assuming he didn't make a straight flush).

In fact, I wrote the above before doing a PokerStove. Results:

Board: 5h 6h Kc
Dead:

equity (%) win (%) tie (%)
Hand 1: 57.8788 % 57.88% 00.00% { KdKs }
Hand 2: 42.1212 % 42.12% 00.00% { 8h7h }

[Dunno]

Im not really sure but i think the set has the advantage here so i would raise (remember sets can make boats) and the K of heart would give u a little better odds so of course u prefer that card.

[mtdoak]

Yes, unless he hits one of his 2 outs, you have, at minimum 10 outs to out draw him . If lets say it was a weaker hand like 2 pair, you would slow down.

[mtdoak]

Rethinking it, no, you would not raise infinitley is this situation, and here's why. Yes, you are +EV, and yes, you have a redraw. But, you only have a 7% edge. If you guys read the stud section of SS, you'll remember Chip Reese talks about waiting for a bigger edge. Why risk all your chips on only a 7% edge when it will go up on a any blank to what, 20%?

[JacksonTens]

No that is wrong.
Because when your edge goes up to 20%, his will go down, making far less likely he will give you the chance to raise infinitely. You have far larger EV infinately raising the flop.

JT [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

[kross]

[ QUOTE ]
But, you only have a 7% edge.

[/ QUOTE ]

Let's round the numbers to 60%/40%, to make things easier.

Out of ten times, you'll win 6, and he will win 4 times.

You win 50% more often than him, not 7%.

Raise, raise, raise.

-- Kevin

[bambi]

I actually had this pot the other day, however it was abit different.

Player A- AQs player b- 10 4o player c- AA

Board

10s 10h 7s

If you knew what the other two players had should you raise infinately with the flush draw? knowing player c has 1 out? but also knowing he will not fold no matter what.

[TheHip41]

All In

This isnt Omaha, where you might actually be a 60-40 dog, the best he could have is an open ended straight/flush draw.