Good spot to wait until turn to raise?

ReadyEddie · #1 11-08-2005, 04:28 PM

villain is 14/7 over 50 hands.

i've stopped abusing the wait until the turn move, so I was just curious if this is an ok spot to bust it out.

Party Poker 2.00/4.00 Hold'em (9 handed) link

Preflop: Hero is BB with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, MP1 raises, 4 folds, Hero calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, MP1 bets, Hero calls, UTG folds.

Turn: (4.25 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, MP1 3-bets, Hero calls.

River: (10.25 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets (all-in), Hero calls.

Final Pot: 11.75 BB.

#2 11-08-2005, 04:30 PM

Misread the action I'll think about it some more

hobbsmann · #3 11-08-2005, 04:30 PM

why are you not 3-betting preflop?

Sure, the flop/turn play is fine.

Scotch78 · #4 11-08-2005, 04:34 PM

Why no re-raise pre-flop? I definitely raise this flop. If MP1 doesn't have an ace, he's less likely to bet into you on the turn and less likely to calldown after a turn raise than a flop raise. If he does have the ace, then he's more likely to re-raise the flop than turn.

Scott

crazygoose · #5 11-08-2005, 04:36 PM

I three bet preflop. I raise the flop because it is three way and there are draws on that board. also, if MP1 is soo short stacked it looks like he's going all the way if he has an ace. Jam while you are ahead. I don't really like that turn check. there are way too many draws villain could take a free card to hit. cap that turn when he's got one bet left. IMO this isn't the best hand to get fancy in.

SeaEagle · #6 11-08-2005, 04:56 PM

You must raise PF here. You really want to put pressure on UTG to fold, since AKo plays much better HU than 3-way.

As you played it, you may as well wait till the turn to raise. If either player has an A, there's no reason for them to think they're outkicked by the BB. If they don't have an A, you're not risking much by giving a free card.

But that's not my first choice - 3-betting PF and betting any flop is a far better approach to this hand.

ReadyEddie · #7 11-08-2005, 06:41 PM

Yeah i normally would 3 bet pf, must've missclicked or w/e..

[ QUOTE ]
I raise the flop because it is three way and there are draws on that board.

[/ QUOTE ]

UTG is not folding to 2 cold on this board, he'd call 2 cold because he's a fish and because he has odds if hes chasing the flush.

yeah i know MP1 is short stacked, and really i dont think it matters what i do, he's throwing all his money in, but lets pretend he isnt short stacked for the sake of the hand.

I think theres a lot of hands in villains range that he keeps on betting the turn with, he's not a total LP, he'll bet this turn with pocket pairs KK and under and he'll bet and pay me off with AJ and AQ

shant · #8 11-08-2005, 07:00 PM

I'd play it differently on every street.

ErrantNight · #9 11-08-2005, 07:32 PM

no.

why are you waiting?

you don't need to protect your hand, and your hand is not so invulnerable as to make slow-playing necessary. if you "need to slow play" because all the pots are small, find a new table.

also, not raising preflop sucks really, really badly.

ErrantNight · #10 11-08-2005, 07:36 PM

(a) if it was a misclick preflop, fine.

(b) you're betting/raising this flop for value. if people fold, fine, if they call, fine. if they raise, 3-bet.

(c) given that you played this so passively the turn will get bet a lot of times. but you REALLY don't want to give free cards on the turn

(d) comments like "he has odds if he's chasing the flush" lead me to believe you're fundamentally misunderstanding why we wait for the turn. if someone has a flush draw on this flop, they're going to see the river. your job is to make sure they pay as much as possible while they chase.