the real simon trumper

[Martin Aigner]

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but if it´s 2 minutes what it takes to make Barry to call, I´d do it every time.



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I really want to play against you then, I estimate we'd get in around 5 hands an hour, and the rest of the time would be spent with me waiting for you to stop [censored] around.

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I think you know exactly what I meant. It seems Barry got outplayed, and likely the only action for Simon to get the other chips was to make this act.

Now I don´t know about you, but I don´t have the nuts that often to only make it for 5 hands in an hour. You must be way more lucky than me.

If somebody takes 2 minutes for an act in 3 days of playing, I accept it if it´s within the rules and serves an purpose. If somebody takes 2 minutes for every action, he will be called for the clock immediatly when it´s his turn (things like that happend already in bubble situations).

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Think about it

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I don´t think I have to think about it, since it was obvious what I meant.

Martin Aigner

[mackthefork]

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but if it´s 2 minutes what it takes to make Barry to call, I´d do it every time.



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I really want to play against you then, I estimate we'd get in around 5 hands an hour, and the rest of the time would be spent with me waiting for you to stop [censored] around.


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I think you know exactly what I meant. It seems Barry got outplayed, and likely the only action for Simon to get the other chips was to make this act.

Now I don´t know about you, but I don´t have the nuts that often to only make it for 5 hands in an hour. You must be way more lucky than me.

If somebody takes 2 minutes for an act in 3 days of playing, I accept it if it´s within the rules and serves an purpose. If somebody takes 2 minutes for every action, he will be called for the clock immediatly when it´s his turn (things like that happend already in bubble situations).


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Think about it


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I don´t think I have to think about it, since it was obvious what I meant.

Martin Aigner

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Fair enough, we'll agree to differ I think it was bang out of order and served no purpose at all, Barry had to put 8k more into a 90k pot with the second nuts, do you really think he needed to ham up like an idiot to get that, I don't.

The river bet by Barry was awful in my opinion, he got himself in a spot he wasn't getting out of, he wasn't outplayed either, the other guy made a donk turn call with 7 outs against one of the best players in the world, hardly the stuff of legend.

Mack

[fyodor]

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the other guy made a donk turn call with 7 outs against one of the best players in the world, hardly the stuff of legend.

Mack

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ST didn't know he only had 7 outs on the turn. He might have the full 9 for the flush. Also what were his other 2 cards? Maybe he had a straight draw as well or even a boat draw.

[mackthefork]

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ST didn't know he only had 7 outs on the turn. He might have the full 9 for the flush. Also what were his other 2 cards? Maybe he had a straight draw as well or even a boat draw.

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Hi

I don't think anyone has mentioned the other 2 cards, we only know about the A8s so yes he could have had additional outs such as two pair or even a set of aces.

Mack

[pokergripes]

Um, I hate to toss any hard facts into this otherwise-entertaining disagreement, but maybe we should remember that Greenstein actually said the following about the hand:

"So, I said I'll make a big enough bet so that if he raises, he'd almost have to have the nuts. So, I grabbed some chips and bet $17,500."

And:

"At this point [after the act], I'm saying the raise only makes sense if he's got the nuts, because I've represented a strong hand. I thought I was beat, but I looked at what I had left and it wouldn't be much if I fold, and it's going to be a pot of $90,000 or so.''

And:

"I said I would hate to condemn someone to be a (naughty word) for taking 10 minutes of everyone's time at the end of the night and somehow be mistaken,'' Greenstein said. "So, I called. Of course he had the nuts."

In other words, he's saying (i) he made a bad bet on the river, (ii) he had planned to toss the hand if he was raised, since obviously would mean he was beaten in light of the size of his bet relative to his remaining chips (so might as well save them), and (iii) he instead called because he wanted to know if it was really an act or not.

Sounds to me like the act worked as intended, and perhaps took down some extra chips. That's part of the game.

Sure, it would be bad if everyone took as much time as they could on every decision throughout a tourney, but so what--that's called a "common pool problem" in economics lingo, and the solution for it is a rule like a clock. Yes, there is some cost associated with calling a clock, but that's true of any rule. Besides, if a particular player does this all the time, then the cost associated with calling a clock on him drops off a lot, since everyone will be doing it.

Ten minutes is a long time. Two or three is not that bad, especially if done for a purpose. And, like they say about politics, poker ain't beanbag either [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]