Feeling lost from the get-go with these suited connectors...

chesspain · #1 06-02-2005, 12:16 PM

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

The BB, MP1, and MP2 are all LA-P, whereas the Button is full-fledged LA-A.

Preflop: chesspain is MP3 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls, 1 fold, Button raises, 1 fold, BB 3-bets, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls, Button caps, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls.

Flop: (20.50 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB bets, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls, Button raises, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls.

Turn: (15.25 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB bets, MP1 calls, MP2 calls $5.75 (All-In), chesspain folds...

Should I have peeled one off one turn, although there is a good chance my diamond cards are dirty, and I may be facing another raise/reraise situation?

Or should I have bailed on this hand even earlier?

meep_42 · #2 06-02-2005, 12:22 PM

I'd be sorely tempted to drop this pf for the 3-bet with button to act behind. (But knowing he caps my influence this)

On the turn, i'm calling 1, and another closing the action, but folding if BB 3-bets -- this pot is huge.

-d

ihardlyknowher · #3 06-02-2005, 12:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

The BB, MP1, and MP2 are all LA-P, whereas the Button is full-fledged LA-A.

Preflop: chesspain is MP3 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls, 1 fold, Button raises, 1 fold, BB 3-bets, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls, Button caps, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls.

Flop: (20.50 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB bets, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls, Button raises, BB calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, chesspain calls.

Turn: (15.25 BB) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
BB bets, MP1 calls, MP2 calls $5.75 (All-In), chesspain folds...

Should I have peeled one off one turn, although there is a good chance my diamond cards are dirty, and I may be facing another raise/reraise situation?

Or should I have bailed on this hand even earlier?

[/ QUOTE ]

I would fold this after the pre-flop 3-bet, since it is 2 back to me.

I would raise the flop. If Button 3-bets, I figure I am against an overpair and call drawing to 4-5 outs.

BigBaitsim (milo) · #4 06-02-2005, 12:27 PM

I'd have dumped this preflop, once it was three-bet and facing a likely 4-bet. You are paying a big price. If you miss, you are done, but if the flop wings you as it did, or leaves you with a draw, you will likely have to pay more than one bet to see your draw. I like the limp, but not the call of the three-bet. Now you are stuck, and with 10BB in the pot, almost have to call a bet on the flop, even when raised. On the turn, there are 15BB, and since you will have to pay no more that 1.5BB for a shot at the river, I'd take one off (although you only have to do this because of the pre-flop call). You are getting 10:1 odds and likely have at least four outs. If you miss, now there are 19BB in the pot, do you fold the river for one more bet? Is there a 5% chance he has AQ, AJ or 77? I think so, which means you call one more bet. Bleh.

Bluffoon · #5 06-02-2005, 12:32 PM

What a mess!

I would fold when it was two back to me preflop. You might be able to mathematically justify calling but look at the black hole this hand develops into.

On a passive table the preflop action indicates some very strong hands and on a more aggressive table you can expect the raising and reraising to continue ad-nauseum (sic?). Either way you are looking at a costly draw unless you flop your hand outright.

chesspain · #6 06-02-2005, 05:11 PM

.

Stack · #7 06-02-2005, 05:27 PM

I call the turn. There's enough in the pot to justify chasing one 8 and two 9s. And I don't think we should discount both diamonds. (Maybe 1 or 1.5)

LImitPlayer · #8 06-02-2005, 05:48 PM

This is a fold pf when it is two more to me.

MHarris · #9 06-02-2005, 05:49 PM

I think your play preflop and on the flop is fine. I'm taking one off on the turn here and folding if it's two more back to me. You're getting 18:1 and it's likely you have at least 4 clean outs....I think the only way I could find a fold here is if my opponent could physically show me KK/K8, which obviously isn't happening here.

man · #10 06-02-2005, 06:15 PM

when the three-bet comes back to you, you are getting 17.5:3 with implied odds. I know you're getting terrible reverse implied odds postflop for your draws, but even on a capped flop and turn between the three of you, you're still getting 20:6 (I think) to chase to the river in a worst-case scenario. I think we have a call here... anyone want to check me on this?

edit: as I thought more about this, I dont' even know if these implied odds mean anything. i.e. 17.5:3 looks nice compared to the 24% of the time your SC hits the flop, but about 20% is hitting a draw, 7% of which actually gets there, and 6% of which won't be counterfeited/beaten. so it seems like 10% of the time you'll be money with these hands.. am I overcomplicating things? help.