Oops. KQo on Button

shadow29 · #1 11-29-2004, 01:35 PM

Reads: SB is tighter than normal. CO is terrible.

I raised the flop b/c I wanted to know how much SB liked his hand and I felt that he would auto-bet any flop after a pre-flop 3-bet. Thus, I wanted to know if he had AK or TT or something else. On the turn, I thought I was good against his AK (what I put him on after his flop 3-bet. Is it okay to call that 3-bet? I think I was getting 14-1.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (8 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
4 folds, CO calls, Hero raises, SB 3-bets, 1 fold, CO calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, CO calls, Hero raises, SB 3-bets, CO calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (9.50 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, CO folds, Hero raises, SB calls.

River: (13.50 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, SB calls.

Final Pot: 17.50 BB
Main Pot: 17.50 BB, between Hero and SB.

brettbrettr · #2 11-29-2004, 01:45 PM

If you're apologizing for raising with KQo, I might have to too. This is an auto-raise for me if no one has...

I like your play here, I play it the same way.

shadow29 · #3 11-29-2004, 01:46 PM

Oh no, I was just saying, "oops what have I gotten myself into"

Shillx · #4 11-29-2004, 01:48 PM

I don't get the flop raise. Why let him off the hook if he has TT and charge yourself more if he has AK??

Shill

brettbrettr · #5 11-29-2004, 01:50 PM

I think you're fine. If you're not looking at AA, then its a set--of course you already knew this. But the stop-n-go after stop-n-go leads me to believe AA and he can't bring himself to not bet it but hasn't the cajones to 3-bet it. If its a set then he's a weakling.

shadow29 · #6 11-29-2004, 03:05 PM

He had the miraclulous KK. Thanks for saving me bets, killa!

Shillx · #7 11-29-2004, 03:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]
He had the miraclulous KK. Thanks for saving me bets, killa!

[/ QUOTE ]

The flop raise is still bad bad bad bad.

shadow29 · #8 11-29-2004, 03:24 PM

I think that defining the hand by the flop raise is good. My thinking was, "If I'm beat, I'll get 3-bet. If I get 3-bet, call, and fold UI on the turn. If I'm ahead, I'll get called."

Is this incorrect?

beginner · #9 11-29-2004, 03:35 PM

I like this much better. The flop raise is correct to test the waters while its still cheap. You don't want to slowplay a hand that has a decent chance to be behind already and raise the turn to pay even more. You also don't want to blindly call this down. I like the flop raise with the plan to fold on turn to further agression. Thats how I play it.

Shillx · #10 11-29-2004, 03:48 PM

N/m my post, I thought that you were out of position.

As for the raise, there are a few problems with it IMO.

A) Once the villian 3-bets, you assume that you are behind but you now have built up the pot to the point where you have to see the river. If the villain has AA/AK, you are getting just about the right price (10.5:1) to see the river card.

B) If the villian has something like QQ and folds the turn, then you would have wished that you didn't raise the flop.

C) Lets say that the villian is tricky and will call your flop raise with AA. Now what do you do once the villian gives you bad information about his hand?

Shill