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#21
06-02-2005, 06:30 AM
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Re: is this stealing
ray, dont be horridly oversimplified and mix the letter of the law(whichever governing body you are referring to) with the spirit of the law. We live in a beauracratic state dont make mountains out of mole hills.
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#22
06-02-2005, 06:31 AM
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Re: is this stealing
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Example, a good friend of mine is a mechanic for a Ford dealership around here. He has told me many times where he will be assigned a simple task like putting running boards on a new F-150 or something, and he'll basically be told to put it down as at least 1 or 2 more hours than he actually spent on it. [/ QUOTE ] This is a poor example for you to use. Dealerships charge their labor based on flat-rate manuals. A certain job pays 2 hours, if the tech gets it done in less, good for him. Some jobs will pay 6 hours and it will take the tech 8 hours to complete it--sucks for him. Customers who whine about it when a tech is able to beat the flat-rate time are ignorant hypocrites. How much cash has the tech invested in the tools of the trade? I have $10,000 worth of tools in my garage, and my box was woefully deficient. Will that same idiot customer who complains about the job being done in less time be willling to fork out extra cash when the job takes longer to complete? Never. I'm starting to get pissed off, so I'll stop here. [/ QUOTE ] I don't know if all dealerships use the "flat rate" method you describe, but the way I read it the other poster was talking about something else. That is, the customer is being charged by the hour and intentionally overcharged. The supervisor said something to the effect of "Make sure you charge the customer for more labor than you actually spent." That's just the way I read his anecdote, your rant notwithstanding.
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#25
06-02-2005, 08:08 AM
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What everyone is ignoring about the Internet
If you are working from your office, on your company's network, then they are paying for the bandwidth. When employees surf the Internet for personal entertainment, they are using bandwidth the could slow down business related transmissions. Also, businesses can have variable rates for their internet service based on the amount of traffic they cause. So you are, in effect, taking something of value. Productivity is not the only issue.
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#26
06-02-2005, 08:32 AM
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Re: What everyone is ignoring about the Internet
This effect is really really really negligible.
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#27
06-02-2005, 08:44 AM
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Re: is this stealing
I saw the thread that spawned this question, and I think a couple of clarifications are in order for those who are unaware.
A lot of computer jobs require obscene amounts of concentration for short bursts of time, which management may or may not be aware of. Time spent surfing the internet replaces time spent at the water cooler, in other people's offices, reading the newspaper, taking smoke breaks, or staring into space. (Anybody who has worked with non-internet savvy people knows that their creativity knows no bounds on avoiding work.) Time spent on the internet does not replace time spent working. Furthermore, at the modern company, there is an implicit contract. Workers work stupid and obscene hours, any time the workplace needs them, and in return, the workplace gets off their back with the strict rules from 9-5. I know the original question assumed a workplace where this is not the case, but these types of workplaces are becoming fewer and fewer. Both sides occasionally take a step back in horror and gasp at this implicit contract, and would *never* view their side as part of the agreement, but it's just the way the world works.
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#28
06-02-2005, 09:56 AM
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Re: is this stealing
This is really an oversimplification wrt many types of jobs. The higher you go responsibility-wise, the less important hours become and the more important results become. I've always managed my teams based on results and they've always come through for me. Only when people underperform do the things you mention become issues.
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#29
06-02-2005, 10:45 AM
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Re: is this stealing
[ QUOTE ]
This is really an oversimplification wrt many types of jobs. The higher you go responsibility-wise, the less important hours become and the more important results become. I've always managed my teams based on results and they've always come through for me. Only when people underperform do the things you mention become issues. [/ QUOTE ] Yes. Its more of a performance issue, not a crime. If the employer is not satisfied with the employee's work ethic, habits, work product, etc. he can boot him. However, example #1 hints at fraud. If you enter an agreement with no intention of performing ... that is fraud. The agreement was that Zee hired someone to watch his sh!t for 8 hours. The guy took the money and booked after 4. This is why businesses and professionals that pad their hours can be prosecuted: They are charging the client for hours not worked ... therefore, intent is easy to prove because if the work was never done, there was no intent to perform.
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