Casino Pros Are Dinosaurs

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These sarcastic posts...

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OMG!!!! Sarcasm?!?! On 2+2?!?!? Say it's not true!!!!!

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[Zetack]

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These sarcastic posts are as pointless as being a casino pro unless u are playing 20/40 nl and higher...

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Oh, like there was any point to your post?

Your post was useless. There's a tremendous variation in skill between various live play pros. There also a tremendous variation in skill between online pros. It makes it really hard to say anything meaningful about a random online pro versus a random (20 year successful) live play pro.

So you'll take a guy whose been a pro online for a year with a 1.3 BB/100 winrate making say 80k over, oh, I don't know...Mason Malmuth?

And take them at what? Heads up? Full table? Live or online?

Like I said worthless.

Having said that, I tend to like a guy who's made a solid living for twenty years at this game over a guy who has made his living at it for a year online.

If your point, on the other hand, is that you can get a whole lot of experience really really fast online, and so its possible for a good onling player to catch up to the experienced live play pros in a relatively short period of time...yeah, I gotta buy that.

--Zetack

[phish]

Generally true, except for a couple of things:

The best casino pros tend to play many games well, whereas the best online pros are one-dimensional.

Playing live, the casino pro would notice tells and reads that the online pro would not be aware of and may be giving out himself.

In general, casino games are much softer than online games and the pro there can focus completely on the one game. His edge is much bigger and hence any downswings are also much smaller.

Online pros talk about trying to win 1bb/100 at the 100/200 games. That would translate into about 0.40BB/hour live. A good casino pro should be able to make 3 to 4 times that playing 200/400 (or even higher) mixed games.

In general, I think the best holdem players today are online, but not true of other games.

[Oblomov]

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Playing live, the casino pro would notice tells and reads that the online pro would not be aware of and may be giving out himself.

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This is the main factor that the original poster left out of his equation. The ability to pick up on tells is a valuable skill in casino-poker, and one that a successful online player may well turn out to lack should he ever try to play in a B&M cardroom. In that case, he will probably find himself being trampled by the dinosaurs. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

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Playing live, the casino pro would notice tells and reads that the online pro would not be aware of and may be giving out himself.

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This is the main factor that the original poster left out of his equation. The ability to pick up on tells is a valuable skill in casino-poker, and one that a successful online player may well turn out to lack should he ever try to play in a B&M cardroom. In that case, he will probably find himself being trampled by the dinosaurs. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

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Tells are pretty easily corrected. Thanks to Mike Caro, there's good literature on the subject.

After the initial adjustment period, the online player will do fine in a casino.

[Brom]

The value of live tells goes way down once one moves up to the decent limits (like the kind of one can make a living at). The competition just isn't giving away tells that are reliable anymore. Also once you get to the high limits, it becomes increasingly harder to win that 1 big bet per hour.

[henrikrh]

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The value of live tells goes way down once one moves up to the decent limits (like the kind of one can make a living at). The competition just isn't giving away tells that are reliable anymore. Also once you get to the high limits, it becomes increasingly harder to win that 1 big bet per hour.

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They are, the tells be more subtle, almost unspottable, but everyone has tells and patterns. It's human nature, you see a big hand you react physically, heart-rate changes a little, whatever. Same thing with bluffing. Aat 20/40 you can be sure tells are a factor.

[soko]

Casino pros will be around longer (forever) than the internet poker boom (years).

[DeadMoneyOC]

"So, I can confidently say I would take a player who has been an online pro for a year, over a casino pro who has been playing 20 years of his life."

Almost all your arguements are flawed. Do you see why? Probably not, I will let someone else elaborate. Besides being a 'dinosaur' and playing in big mixed limit games or huge NL games with no cap is about 100x cooler than multi-tabling on line.

So, I can count on not seeing you at one of my B&M tables?

I can live with that.

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