Mike Matasow is a raving lunatic

[Steve00007]

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He also mentions that he saw a big tell on Fossilman in the WSOP in 04 and that's why he felt like he pwned him. Has Greg figured out what the hell he was talking about?

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If that's true, then why mention it in the interview? Does he want Greg to beat him the next time they run into each other?

[Rosie5]

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If that's true, then why mention it in the interview? Does he want Greg to beat him the next time they run into each other?

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I'm sure he'll be kicking himself the next time he steps through the doors at burger king

[benkahuna]

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But, where mental stamina is a significant factor in performance, it does not seem unreasonable to restrict drugs if you want to make sure the playing field is level.

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It's still nonsense. I think your comment, despite its ostensible reasonableness, ignores the reality of drugs that could aid mental stamina.

You're living in some sort of weird ideal world, not this one. Are you going to ban caffeine? You get a similar edge in the short term from caffeine that you get from amphetamines. It might even be better because caffeine doesn't have the issues involving dopaminergic pathways that are involved in schizophrenia. Are you going to ban cocaine? That helps people stay awake too? Many of these stimulant drugs affecting noradrenergic neurons are only effective in the short term and their intermediate or long term use can cause problems which would impair one's ability at the poker table in addition to any issues related to mental clarity. So then you may be punishing people who are already punishing themselves.

If you don't allow older players to use caffeine, could that be construed as age discrimination since older players (Harrington claims this at least) don't have the energy needed to play for long period s of time and pay attention? Are we going to discriminate against people addicted to cocaine or methamphetamine? Are we going to discriminate against addicts now too?

I'm a little surprised that your response came after someone mentioned a person taking a drug prescribed to them by a licensed physican. Obviously, context matters (such as whether the drug was taken as prescribed and for a real medical condition, not just for the tournament). Are we now going to discriminate against people with medical conditions treated by stimulant drugs?

Our society is unbelieveably hypocritical about drugs, largely based on misunderstanding about them and an irrational fear of addiction. Addiction rates, even after drugs were made illegal and even following many major drug law changes in the US have stayed about the same.

[rheaume]

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I don't know about the drugs part, but after reading his Card Player interview, I have to believe this guy is certifiably nuts!!

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do you have a link

[MeanGreenTT]

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Will we need to start drug testing at major tournaments?

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I'll stop taking adderall before a poker tournament when the guy next to me turns off his friggin insulin pump.

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What a HUGE ASSHAT comment to make....

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But, where mental stamina is a significant factor in performance, it does not seem unreasonable to restrict drugs if you want to make sure the playing field is level.

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It's still nonsense. I think your comment, despite its ostensible reasonableness, ignores the reality of drugs that could aid mental stamina.

You're living in some sort of weird ideal world, not this one. Are you going to ban caffeine?

[/ QUOTE ]I didn't say it was prectical, but rather that the objective was not unreasonable.

I also said "restrict" rather than "ban", caffeine being a perfect example of a drup which would likely be acceptable in limited quantities. There was an uproar in the bridge community about testing for caffeine until it was realized that to go over the allowable level one would have to drink something like a gallon of coffee in an hour.

[flo]

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Are you going to ban cocaine?

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It's illegal in most parts of the civilized world, as far as i know...

[benkahuna]

So, hypothetically speaking, you're for restricting performance-enhancing drugs, including caffeine... And as an example to support your point, you mention a quantity of caffeine that few humans would drink and that also has a decent chance of having a negative effect on poker performance unless someone has built up a fantastic tolerance to caffeine--and if someone had, why would it be fair to not allow them to imbibe enough caffeine to see its positive effects. Now we're penalizing the very caffeine tolerant. I see you talking hypothetically, then mentioning a largely inapplicable example to allay concerns I had about the situation.

Let's just completely cast aside practical issues about discrimination, whether any drug would significantly help, and the difficulty of enforcement.

Your goal here is to "level the playing field" apparently. Well, the playing field is not level and it never will be. I'll try to consider what you meant, let's say about one player not having an major advantage over another (beyond luck and skill). You're looking for a strong analogy with anabolic hormones and other performance-enhancing drugs like erythropoeitin (also a hormone). It's noble in a way, but still based on the a priori assumption that drugs are bad. This case doesn't even consider how poorly defined a "drug" is.

What it boils down to here is basically a strong moral position against some exogenous substances, but apparently not caffeine because our society has made it legal (even though I'd rate it at or near the top for the performance enhancement that concerns you. There is no inherent reasonableness or unreasonableness to this position, but it sure sounds like a sloppy, unsophisticated argument to me. That's without even considering the practical world where the argument breaks down in an even worse manner.

[benkahuna]

Red herring. A drug's legality has not yet been discussed and was never part of either argument here. If you're saying you're going to ban cocaine because it's illegal, do you now ban all other substances that are also illegal? Would it only be when people were playing or are you going to try to deal with people's use of substances when they're not playing as well?

[evil_twin]

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What a horrible idea. This is quite possibly the single most retarded sugestion ever made on these forums.

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Or it would have been had it not actually been phrased as a question.