I am a LOSER, not a winner!!! Help - Page 2

Yesterday · #11 01-16-2004, 09:46 AM

thanks for the advise....

I think that the biggest thing that i did yesterday was pretend that I was playing in a casino. At a casino I can usually win, but i would be embarrassed to lose $200 at a 5-10 game, so why is it alright to lose $80 at a 2-4 game. So I really tightened up and thought about why I was losing when I rarely lose at the casino regina where all the farmers roam and donate there cash.

David I was meaning to ask you a question. I have been reading you posts for a short while now and wonder, because i have in my short stint online already noticed it, but do you ever notice that sometimes when you are playing, you find yourself playing for the wrong reason? Like, you are playing to make money right? do you ever find yourself just playing a game and beating players and you get so focused on these sorts of things that you don't realize the real reason that you are playing????

FredJones888 · #12 01-16-2004, 12:55 PM

you know it depends on what your goal is. If you are primarily interested in building skill and becoming a long term grinder than what you just suggested is obviously not the way to go about it.

On the other hand, if you view poker as gambling and then the real goal is win as quickly as possible. Whatever method you use the money spends the same.

Some people bet $2 a horse on 50 races a year at the track, some people bet $100 on a 60 to 1 horse one time and win (this actually happend to my mother in law a couple of weeks ago at her first ever visit to a horse track). Which person is more successfull ? Depends on your perspective I guess.

Chris Moneymaker was a losing pathological gambler in 2002 and now he is a hero, and he was never a skilled grinder or a tournament pro, yet he has already had more success than most "pro" gamblers of any type.

are you doing this to be a skilled player, or as a get rich quick scheme ?

I like playing poker, but if I don't start beating the low limits soon I will have to find another game to play. Skill is nice, but money talks. At this point I would settle for going up to $3/$6 and getting lucky.

wontons · #13 01-16-2004, 01:30 PM

something to keep in mind...A Good and skilled poker player will win 1 to 1.5 big bets per hour of play...if you play 8 hours at 1-2 and win 1 bb per hour that is a mere 16 dollars...If money is an issue which it is for MANY poker players..I would stick to tourneys...but i like tournaments alot dont know your ideology on tournaments. So if your playing for entertainment value realize making 30 into 2k means you are def gambling and not playing correct pot odds in limit poker games...hell i mean i put 60 into a site and turned it into 1160...but im sure i was gambling and not playing correct poker.

Robk · #14 01-16-2004, 01:32 PM

Great post Eugene. Most other people in this thread are way off. Discipline, patience, buy-ins, blah. If you don't believe me take it from Sklansky:

"My writings have always stressed that the most important aspect of making money at poker is the ability to play expertly. Other factors, such as game selection, money management, staying off tilt, etc ... are of only secondary importance..."

Get more books. Read more posts. Read your old books again. Play more hands. There's no secret to becoming a winner, it just takes hard work.

meeeee · #15 01-16-2004, 01:49 PM

see one thing that gets me is about how people are talking about bank roll. Well, we go to the casino and play 10-20 with $300 right, so what is the big deal about playing a certain limit online with 30-40 times the big bet. I think that if you play poker properly then you shouldn’t need 300 big bets to play a limit. Maybe for players that play every day and need to play the swings. But I play about 2 times a week for a few hours, I sit down with lots of time and patience and play whatever I think that I can play for that day, I scout the tables, see the players and judge from there....

People that play just strictly percentages will win, but also people that use instincts and situational thinking and positions, I think are the real poker players......

Any thoughts???

davidross · #16 01-16-2004, 02:31 PM

Certainly that can happen. I try hard to just make the right decision every time it's my play, that's the best we can do. Even if you lose that particular pot, you are making decisions that you think will be right a greater than even percentage of the time. When some bozo raises me with the 2nd best hand and then hits his 3 outer on teh river I do steam, and want to get even with him, but that is usually a counter productive emotion, leading to more losses. It just turns me into one of the fish I'm trying to beat.

Discipline is extremely important id you want to make money long term in this game.

lefty rosen · #17 01-16-2004, 04:38 PM

Yeah moneymaker is a joke from what I heard, at limit poker. Supposedly he is getting cleaned out for big bucks at the high limit games at various casinos. I hope he doesn't end up tapping his 2million(less taxes).

naphand · #18 01-16-2004, 04:58 PM

I'm beginning to really like this thread.... [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

It seems to be turning into a war based on the proposition *I'd rather be lucky than good* (often quoted on the tables I play).

all_aces · #19 01-16-2004, 05:20 PM

Hey Yesterday,

Sorry about the capital letters in the subject line, but I don't want this post to get buried in what is turning into a thread of epic proportions.

Good for you for starting it off, by the way.

About Casino Regina... I live in Toronto and have heard (and read) that the biggest and best tournaments in Canada happen at Casino Regina. Is this true? Have you ever played in one? What's it like? What's the buy-in/payout usually like? Etc.. etc.. etc.. Any opinions you have on Casino Regina tournaments would be greatly appreciated.

Feel free to send me a PM (private message) if you'd rather keep this discussion out of this thread.

Thanks,
all_aces

BigBaitsim (milo) · #20 01-17-2004, 09:33 AM

You are right and wrong. If you want to have a little fun, got to a casino or online, plunk down 20-25 BB at any limit and go to town. If you want to win consistently and earn a bit (I see poker as a sort of "second job"), then play disciplined, play often and do all the things davidross and others like him recommend. I've built my $50 buy in to over $2000 and am looking to move to either 3/6 or 5/10 shorthanded soon. I built this bankroll slowly, over the course of 20k hands. It was tedious and a bit boring, but the poker has been free for me, since my buy-in was cashed out long ago. My wife is fine with my hobby, because I'm playing with your money. Decide why you are playing, then play accordingly.