88 Live at the Bike. 30/60

[CardSharpCook]

Fun fun game. Plays so very small stakes. 7-handed. SB tilted off his stack, got it back, and seems to be tilting it off again.

UTG+1: 40/8/.6
SB: 65/22/2 (guesses, of course)

I have been card dead and folding just about everything.

UTG +1 raises, I 3bet with 88, SB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] SB bets, UTG calls, I raise, SB 3bets, UTG calls, I call.

Verbal and betting tell indicate that SB has 5x.

Turn: J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] SB checks, UTG checks, I bet, SB raises, UTG calls, I....

Verbal and betting tell STILL indicate that SB has 5x.

[flawless_victory]

welll, reraise!

[CardSharpCook]

obviously my problem isn't SB. Sure, my read may be off, but I am pretty sure that it he is spewing. But what about UTG calling 2 cold on the flop, and 2 more cold on the turn? He is the kind of guy who doesn't know how to fold a pair, but he'd give up on overcards by now, right? Having played with him, I'm pretty sure he does. I also don't think he is raising 66/77 PF.

[flawless_victory]

he has a heart draw or AJ most likely, but he could also be calling w/ AK... this game is donked out, right?
ive seen ppl withastand insane action to chase in donkey 20/40 games, raise.
if youre really concerned about him, check the river.

[Dazarath]

What about calling and then calling 1 more on the river, but not 2?

[flawless_victory]

raising again might convine UTG that TT no good, also you charge him another bet if he has AhTh... sure hes got alot of outs, but so what...

[ QUOTE ]
obviously my problem isn't SB. Sure, my read may be off, but I am pretty sure that it he is spewing. But what about UTG calling 2 cold on the flop, and 2 more cold on the turn? He is the kind of guy who doesn't know how to fold a pair, but he'd give up on overcards by now, right? Having played with him, I'm pretty sure he does. I also don't think he is raising 66/77 PF.

[/ QUOTE ]
Wow this hand got out of control. Here's my take on it...

PREFLOP: To me this is a fold, 88's do not play well against the range of this raiser in his position, but if you re gonna play it, it looks to me that you would be better off just cold calling since judging by the texture of this table 3 betting will never get you heads up with the initial raiser. Cold calling and play for set value seems to be the best option at this table if youre are going to play, however I still think folding is your best option in this spot.

Lets fast forward to the TURN: I believe in your read on the wild player even after he checkraises the turn, but there is still chance your read is wrong, and it is pretty clear to me at this point that the initial preflop raiser has a better hand than you and he is not folding. Another thing thats important is it is always possible that the wild player has J5. I would fold the turn to the checkraise more so becuz the UTG+1 called than the action of the wild player, but the small chance the wild player does have a 3 or a jack does contribute to why I would fold the turn. I know the pot is big but I just dont see how youre ahead here often enough to justify continuing in this hand.

Side note: If you feel compelled to stay in this hand, just call the turn checkraise, reraising would be insane.

[CardSharpCook]

Westley, you just summed up everything I was thinking on the turn. "God damn it, Brendan, this was a PF fold and you know it. UTG has TT. He's not maintaining delusions of winning this with an Ace or king on the river. SB MAY have the damned 3, even though you know damn well he doesn't. Your only hope now is to spike an 8 and you don't even have the implied odds to go fishing for that." I folded the turn.

The river was T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], SB checked, UTG bet and I thought, "Brendan, you're a genious. He just filled up." Sadly no. He had the flush. As expected, SB turns over 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and UTG flips A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Though my error saved me $120, I felt like a damned idiot. The salt in the wound was SB berating UTG for fishing down the flush and getting lucky on him.

[ QUOTE ]
Westley, you just summed up everything I was thinking on the turn. "God damn it, Brendan, this was a PF fold and you know it. UTG has TT. He's not maintaining delusions of winning this with an Ace or king on the river. SB MAY have the damned 3, even though you know damn well he doesn't. Your only hope now is to spike an 8 and you don't even have the implied odds to go fishing for that." I folded the turn.

The river was T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], SB checked, UTG bet and I thought, "Brendan, you're a genious. He just filled up." Sadly no. He had the flush. As expected, SB turns over 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and UTG flips A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Though my error saved me $120, I felt like a damned idiot. The salt in the wound was SB berating UTG for fishing down the flush and getting lucky on him.

[/ QUOTE ]
Thats hilarious. I still think that folding this turn was the right move. I mean think about it, what just happened here was a low probability event, the event that just occurred here was that you actually did have the best hand on the turn, But even in this best case scenario there were still 15 cards that could hit the river to beat you. So even when you do somehow have both opponents beat on the turn that small percentage of time, you will still get rivered 33% of the time, but when you are trailing the vast majority of time, you will be drawing to 2 outs. I still think you made the right decision to fold the turn.

[Surfbullet]

I'd 3bet. I like raising, especially when I expect to be ahead like-so.

Surf