(Home Game) How to play a short stack against weak players ??

[BillFranklin]

for whatever reason (variance or whatever) i've run in this situation alot over the last month or so. Normally when your short stacked you wanna pick a hand go all in and then double to have chance to win or bust.

Keep in my this post only deals with situations where your short stacked and playing with weak players or have a weak player in the BB.

I'm beggining to wonder if this is the best strategy against really bad players. Say your short stacked and you pick up A8s. if the blinds are getting up there you would consider moving in with this hand especially if the table is short handed. But your playing againts bad players (oh ! i have 2 face cards, i call) Your pushing a small edge against a really weak player. If your not dominated and have the best hand (i'm not talking a Pocket pairs these are easy to play) your at best a 60-40 favorite.

I'm wondering if calling with the intention of moving in the flop no matter what is a better play against this type of player. Normally these players play loose preflop but can't play post flop at all. The odds of one of these players missing the flop is about 68%. So your picking up about an 8% advantage by waiting to see the flop (of course if the other hits the flop your dead, but you would've lost no matter what)
Against this type of player you have no fold equity preflop but have some post flop. Granted your not accomplishing your task of doubling up but if you applied this strategy successfully 2 or 3 times you could be in decent shape.

Wondering what everyone's thought are. am i way of base here?

[smoore]

I do this with regularity. It works. YMMV. Good thought process in any case.

[BillFranklin]

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I do this with regularity. It works. YMMV. Good thought process in any case.

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What does YMMV mean ?

[Stickmn24]

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What does YMMV mean ?

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Your mileage may vary (meaning that it might not work as well for you).

[BillsChips]

Read Ed Miller's short stack strategy in "Getting Started in Hold'em". YOU'RE on the right track but shouldn't be playing hands as weak as A8s.

[ldavidjm]

If you're saying its wrong to play A8s via moving in or the alternative call/movein on the flop strategy as a shortie you're very wrong.

Like everything it depends but I will use this strategy from time to time. Sometimes you can even get a fold on a missed flop out of very bad players when you have less than 2 BB, call and then movein on the flop. (when they have nothing they are more likely to fold then before the flop when they have the opportunity to make a big hand)

[BillsChips]

I don't see in the original post that he had only 2 bb or less...I think that's your assumption. Playing the short stack strategy that I'm referring to is usually meant to be 25 Big blinds or less.

[BillFranklin]

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I don't see in the original post that he had only 2 bb or less...I think that's your assumption. Playing the short stack strategy that I'm referring to is usually meant to be 25 Big blinds or less.

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Thanks for the replies. I guess the original post was kinda of vague but i was really refering to tournament situations when your in the 8 to 10BB range. Not sure if this changes anyone's opinions?

[smoore]

I'm definitely down with the call/push method when at 8-10BB (no antes) against a weak player in the same situation I would simply push against a strong player.

This brings to mind a question, what would everyone who *would* use the call/push think if you're holding something like A9s, 8BB deep and have exactly one fish and one competent player behind you yet to act before the two "average" ("average" for a home tournament is less than or equal to competent) blinds? How about if it's first a competent player and THEN the fish? The competent player is in no way desperate, lets say 35BB. The blinds are not desperate and we'll assume the fish doesn't think like that.

Against just the fish I'm going to use the c/p move about 50% of the time and the straight push 50% of the time. I think this hand is *just* strong enough to push into a loose caller (Ax, any PP, any two broadway). Against the competent player it's an easy 100% push unless he looks like he's itching for me to do it (then only 70% [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img] ). I'm going to have to think this over some.

[beekeeper]

It would depend on how short-stacked you are relative to the blinds and other stacks, but if it's late in tournament, like the final table, I still like going all-in (if getting called all-in is what you want).

Let's say it's the final table and there's something like 4-6 players left. Everyone knows you are short-stacked and are looking for a hand to push. They also know that with each round of blinds, your hand selection will become less choosy. I think someone will call with less than optimal holdings for the chance to knock you out. With a hand like A8 you want to be heads up anyway, don't you? If you just call, and more than one player catches something on the flop, I think you'll find it harder to win the hand.

Plus, at our game, players are starting the check it down after another player's moved all-in, to increase their chance of knocking someone out.