Maybe I need some help - Page 6

chaz64 · #51 10-12-2005, 03:14 PM

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I pretty much use the SSH starting chart for tight games as my basis for every session and right around 14% is where I always end up.

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Do you adjust it to reflect the fact we have six players instead of ten? That is to say, disregard the advice for early position hands - pretend it's a full table and the first four players have folded.

If you have not seen this already, it may be of some help, I hope:

Hypermegachi's 6-Max Texas Hold'em Limit Guide - Pre-Flop Play

King Yao's book also has some good material on short handed play. I hope things turn around for you soon.

Aaron W. · #52 10-12-2005, 03:22 PM

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I pretty much use the SSH starting chart for tight games as my basis for every session and right around 14% is where I always end up.

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Stop using the chart as a crutch to keep you from learning about true preflop play. The chart is only there to prop you up just long enough to figure out how to stand on your own.

chaz64 · #53 10-12-2005, 03:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I pretty much use the SSH starting chart for tight games as my basis for every session and right around 14% is where I always end up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you adjust it to reflect the fact we have six players instead of ten? That is to say, disregard the advice for early position hands - pretend it's a full table and the first four players have folded.

If you have not seen this already, it may be of some help, I hope:

Hypermegachi's 6-Max Texas Hold'em Limit Guide - Pre-Flop Play

King Yao's book also has some good material on short handed play. I hope things turn around for you soon.

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Thought this was the 6-max thread I read earlier - sorry, never mind.

bozlax · #54 10-12-2005, 03:35 PM

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I pretty much use the SSH starting chart for tight games as my basis for every session and right around 14% is where I always end up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Stop using the chart as a crutch to keep you from learning about true preflop play. The chart is only there to prop you up just long enough to figure out how to stand on your own.

[/ QUOTE ]

Atta boy! Tough love!

kiemo · #55 10-12-2005, 03:58 PM

[ QUOTE ]
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I pretty much use the SSH starting chart for tight games as my basis for every session and right around 14% is where I always end up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Stop using the chart as a crutch to keep you from learning about true preflop play. The chart is only there to prop you up just long enough to figure out how to stand on your own.

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Well I dont keep them in front of me and consult them every hand. Using them as a basis means thats my starting point for preflop play. It gets adjusted based on the table and players and as Boz noticed sometimes the current direction the wind.

And honestly I havent even looked at the charts in months. I think I will go review them.

kiemo · #56 10-12-2005, 04:01 PM

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The problem is multi-fold, but it boils down to this: the players in the micros are too loose to let you make money consistently stealing blinds, and they're too passive to build big pots when it's big hand vs. big hand. So your monsters are going to win small-to-mid sized pots, and you're not going to be picking up anything to pad that. Subtract from that the times that you're raising preflop and folding when the flop doesn't hit you in the face, and the blinds that you're just giving away, and you're losing money, hard.

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Just quoting this for emphasis. Good nutshell explanation of what I think I am experiencing right now.

milesdyson · #57 10-12-2005, 04:21 PM

need i say raise preflop? and bet the river.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 max, 8 handed) internettexasholdem.com

Preflop: Hero is UTG with T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Hero calls, 1 fold, MP1 raises, 5 folds, Hero calls.

Flop: (5.50 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets, Hero raises, MP1 3-bets, Hero calls.

Turn: (5.75 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets, Hero calls.

River: (7.75 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP1 checks.

Final Pot: 7.75 BB

milesdyson · #58 10-12-2005, 04:22 PM

i'm on my lunch break, and i decided to get through the whole 300 hands. why aren't you limping this?

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 max, 9 handed) internettexasholdem.com

Preflop: Hero is UTG with 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls, 2 folds, CO calls, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (5 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB bets, BB folds, MP1 calls, CO folds, Button folds.

Turn: (3.50 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, MP1 calls.

River: (5.50 BB) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, MP1 raises, SB calls.

Final Pot: 9.50 BB

..........and why did you check the flop here?

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 max, 7 handed) internettexasholdem.com

Preflop: Hero is Button with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
3 folds, CO calls, Hero raises, 1 fold, BB calls, CO calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB checks, CO checks, Hero checks.

SomethingClever · #59 10-12-2005, 04:31 PM

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13.78/7.70 <------------------ your problem. also i quickly went through your hands and found this one.

Party Poker 1/2 Hold'em (9 max, 8 handed) internettexasholdem.com

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, Hero raises, 1 fold, CO calls, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (14 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (7 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG bets, UTG+1 calls, Hero folds ...

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As you and lautzutao pointed out this might be a leak, but I generally will fold this everytime on a 2 suited coordinated board with a raiser and a caller and 4 more to act behind me. Also as Aaron pointed out, I dont call alot. I either raise or fold and this looks to me like a terrible hand continue, I am more inclined to play on without the 2 spades though.

A call might seem correct here getting 16-1, but I got 4 people still to act and I dont want to pay any more for what I count as a about a 5 outer and a raise here doesnt do much good as I am not getting made hands or drawing hands to fold. Or am I way overanalyzing this? 5 outs is 4-1 to hit by river, or 11-1 to hit on turn. Getting 16-1 and probably higher implied odd is this an immediate call?

Appreciate the look you gave..

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Good lord, this is a must call, if not raise.

SomethingClever · #60 10-12-2005, 04:32 PM

Don't coldcall. 3-bet that AQ unless you have a read that he's really tight.