Evaluate this silly ass cowboys hand.

imported_anacardo · #1 08-18-2005, 10:26 PM

Villain has played every hand of the last 23 and has a postflop AF ~2.0.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed) converter

MP3 ($78.65)
CO ($95.40)
Button ($39.67)
SB ($40.25)
BB ($22)
UTG ($45.75)
UTG+1 ($49.50)
Hero ($79.68)
MP1 ($71.80)
MP2 ($76.10)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $0.25.
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to $2, Hero raises to $6, 2 folds, MP3 calls $6, 4 folds, UTG+1 calls $4.

Flop: ($18.75) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
UTG+1 checks, Hero bets $14, MP3 calls $14, UTG+1 folds.

Turn: ($46.75) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP3 thinks it over and pushes, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $46.75

kongo_totte · #2 08-18-2005, 10:56 PM

Man, this is ugly. That is all I have to say. A turn bet would commit you so I don't like that. Man, ugly.

imported_anacardo · #3 08-18-2005, 10:59 PM

I thought much the same. Is there any way I could avoided this retardation in the first place?

I fear my mind is melting. This has been the worst week of my career. One-outers, three-outers, runner-runner flushes. The pain - when will it end?

ScottTheFish · #4 08-18-2005, 11:15 PM

Tough one. So hard to give him credit for a hand playing donkish like that for the last 23 hands.

I think a leak in my game is not being able to give clowns like this credit for a hand. I don't know if I could lay down an overpair to this guy. He could easily have AK or AQ with the A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] and is pouncing on the turn check...Then again he's playing every hand so he could have 86 or 82 or whatever. Ugh.

I probably call, lose, and puke in that order. Like I said...Leeeeeeeeeeak.

jacknine · #5 08-19-2005, 02:40 AM

Are you sure the check on the turn isn't an open invitation for him to try and steal?
Don't you think if he really made a good hand he would've checked behind you or made some sort of weak bet, hoping you'd try to raise or bet out again on the river? Unless ofcourse he played a small pair and wants to protect his trips/2 crappy pair...

I'd have probably pushed on the turn myself, I suppose it's all wrong too but judging from what you said about villain he might as well have A8o ... or just about anything else... Indeed not a pretty situation.

imported_anacardo · #6 08-19-2005, 03:05 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Are you sure the check on the turn isn't an open invitation for him to try and steal?
Don't you think if he really made a good hand he would've checked behind you or made some sort of weak bet, hoping you'd try to raise or bet out again on the river? Unless ofcourse he played a small pair and wants to protect his trips/2 crappy pair...

I'd have probably pushed on the turn myself, I suppose it's all wrong too but judging from what you said about villain he might as well have A8o ... or just about anything else... Indeed not a pretty situation.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's the problem. He could be holding any two. I feel quite certain that he had some piece of the board on the flop, but that's it. Basically, I'm completely lost and have no idea how to have prevented it.

brian94709 · #7 08-19-2005, 03:37 AM

Hmm, tough one. Looks like you should have bet say, half the pot on the turn. I think you could legitamitely fold to a push at that point.

You're really screwed if he calls again though [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]. Not sure what I'd suggest for the river then. Check, call, check fold or push are the only options at that point. I'd probably go for check, call.
Tough hand.

#8 08-19-2005, 05:31 AM

I reckon he's on a flush draw, pot odds are $32.75/$14 for his call, If he on a 4 flush he got a 36% chance of hitting so he's only about $3 out on the call, he hit his spade on turn and has posisition.

Personally I have only ever played 9/10 player NL holdem and I dissregard AA KK as being small winners and big loosers. With a flush draw there is also the potential for a big pot, alot of small NL players would feel commited and bet out at which point "cowboy" takes their stack, I think the $14 bet was to small and you let him in on the draw.

The $6 opener? I never see the point in this play, either everybody chucks and you win 75c or it goes like above.

In low limit no limit I've come round to thinking that whatever playable hand you have (bar the trash) you got to limp in and play your hand on after the flop, including AA KK.

Malachii · #9 08-19-2005, 05:45 AM

Against a normal opponent, I think this fold would be very good, that smooth call of a raise + reraise + a smooth call of flop bet + push on the turn = 90% aces.

Given this:

[ QUOTE ]
Villain has played every hand of the last 23 and has a postflop AF ~2.0.

[/ QUOTE ] I would beat him into the pot and expect to see TT-QQ a fair amount of the time here.

tj68 · #10 08-19-2005, 04:58 PM

ive been having a real hard time with this type of hand against opponents i have little respect for lately.ive been seeing a lot of flush draws with absolutely ANY two suited.
im either going to start playing these hands just like you did,or ...is this kind of hand close enough that giving up on it would reduce variance vs possible +ev.where do i draw the line?do i wait for a king?(that wouldnt make it easier,i guess)i dont know yet.thanks for the hand.
if i were to follow my instincts based on Results,i would start pushing any 4 flush.it sure has been working against me.i recently moved up to 50nl.seems this happens a lot here.maybe its more noticible to me cause of the $?does anyone else expect to see bunches of losing hands against these flush chasers,flush draw pushers?this sounds whiney. sorry.