flush draw + overs

schwza · #1 11-30-2005, 12:17 PM

villain is 67/7 over ~80 hands, but i only observed them, so no real reads.

i haven't really played since party switched from 50x stacks to 100x. before the switch my plan would've been to raise and be content to get all-in on the flop, but now what?

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (6 max, 6 handed) converter

MP ($144.10)
Hero ($95.50)
Button ($185.80)
SB ($99.10)
BB ($185.67)
UTG ($74.25)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds, Hero raises to $4, 2 folds, BB calls $3.

Flop: ($8.50) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $5, hero?

jkkkk · #2 11-30-2005, 12:21 PM

Call.

Ghazban · #3 11-30-2005, 12:33 PM

What would you do with red AA there?

schwza · #4 11-30-2005, 12:36 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What would you do with red AA there?

[/ QUOTE ]

i don't know. and since i've played about 5 hands with villain, i don't think he knows either.

i think the more relevant question is what does villain think i would do with red AA, which i would guess is raise. (and he'd probably be right).

Godfather80 · #5 11-30-2005, 12:47 PM

[ QUOTE ]
villain is 67/7 over ~80 hands, but i only observed them, so no real reads.

i haven't really played since party switched from 50x stacks to 100x. before the switch my plan would've been to raise and be content to get all-in on the flop, but now what?

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (6 max, 6 handed) converter

MP ($144.10)
Hero ($95.50)
Button ($185.80)
SB ($99.10)
BB ($185.67)
UTG ($74.25)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds, Hero raises to $4, 2 folds, BB calls $3.

Flop: ($8.50) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $5, hero?

[/ QUOTE ]

My first reaction is to pot it, but villain is letting you draw fairly cheaply. I'm curious as to what types of hands he'll lead into a preflop raiser on the flop.

Ghazban · #6 11-30-2005, 12:50 PM

I play these pretty fast so I'd almost always raise. Most players (but not all) will raise an overpair, too. You're only screwed if he has a set. Even against two pair, you're not that big a dog. Raising will often buy you the option to take a free river if the turn bricks. The downside is that you might get 3bet but I don't really mind calling all-in on a board like this, either. Fish will think you're a fish if you play that aggressively with "just a draw" and pay off your made hands later.

schwza · #7 11-30-2005, 12:52 PM

i make it 18 and he makes it 40. i push now? this is why 50x seems so much easier.

Ghazban · #8 11-30-2005, 12:57 PM

[ QUOTE ]
i make it 18 and he makes it 40. i push now? this is why 50x seems so much easier.

[/ QUOTE ]

Kind of, but not really. You obviously can't fold getting immediate odds for your flush on the next card. Then the pot will be so big you'll get odds for your flush on the river, too. Therefore, you call and push (as a bet or raise, whatever) a non-board-pairing club turn, call a brick turn that doesn't pair the board, and fold if the board pairs as you're almost certainly up against a board. If the board pairs on the turn and he checks, you chuckle quietly to yourself and fold the river even if you make your hand.

schwza · #9 11-30-2005, 01:03 PM

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (6 max, 6 handed) converter

MP ($144.10)
Hero ($95.50)
Button ($185.80)
SB ($99.10)
BB ($185.67)
UTG ($74.25)

Preflop: Hero is CO with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds, Hero raises to $4, 2 folds, BB calls $3.

Flop: ($8.50) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $5, Hero calls $5.

Turn: ($18.50) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, hero?

ok, i called on the theory that it would be good to keep the pot small in case i hit a pair. now what?

Ghazban · #10 11-30-2005, 01:06 PM

His line makes no sense at all [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] I check behind.