Confusing 2/4 hand - Page 2

Hoi Polloi · #11 04-24-2005, 11:59 AM

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As many posters have said, the answer is to bet and fold to a check/raise. On the turn you should tend to check a hand with outs and bet a hand without. You don't have (m)any outs, so you should bet. If they checked to you the board may be as scary to them as it is to you. You can definitely fold to a check/raise, but you don't want lone hearts/aces taking a free card.

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What he said.

festis_jr · #12 04-24-2005, 12:20 PM

How does this hand ends? You win?

damaniac · #13 04-24-2005, 12:34 PM

I really really disagree with folding to a c/r. We're getting either 13.5-1 or 15.5-1 depending on BB. We probably have 4 outs if behind, as CO almost certainly doesn't have a 6, and unless BB raises, I'm not fearing one from him either.

I don't especially like checking as our hand may still be good and I would rather BB donate another bet when chasing his bd flush/gutshot straight/whatever the F he has. Bet/call.

MrOnizuka · #14 04-24-2005, 03:09 PM

Ok, consensus seems to be to bet. Which is what I did.

Both just call? Now I have really no idea what the BB could have, but I think I've elminated AA from the CO, unless he's somehow put me on AK [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and is getting into checkdown mode.

River is a complete blank , 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

They both check to me again. Enough value in another bet here?

Yobz · #15 04-24-2005, 03:18 PM

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Ok, consensus seems to be to bet. Which is what I did.

Both just call? Now I have really no idea what the BB could have, but I think I've elminated AA from the CO, unless he's somehow put me on AK [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and is getting into checkdown mode.

River is a complete blank , 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

They both check to me again. Enough value in another bet here?

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Yes, value bet it.

Btw, if BB c/red the turn, I would fold. If BB folded and CO c/red, i would have called down. If BB called and CO c/red I would be in a tough spot [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

ErrantNight · #16 04-24-2005, 06:30 PM

once your opponents certainly didn't improve, and have yet to show aggression on the big streets, how could this not be a practically mindless auto-bet on the river?

MrOnizuka · #17 04-24-2005, 07:32 PM

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If BB called and CO c/red I would be in a tough spot

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Funny, cause thats exactly what happened on the river. Bet, call, check-raise by CO.

I'm getting like 16-1 on a call here, assuming BB calls, but I'm just so sure I'm beat. CO can't possibly expect me to fold after all that, so what could he possibly have. I ended up agonizing and folding.

Anyways BB calls. UB does this thing where the cards are shown at different times, so I see CO's cards first.
He shows QQ, BB shows 910 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] to take it down. [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

I should clarify that BB, while a call machine is not a total donk, meaning I havent seen him showdown with out at least a pair.

So, general question:
On the turn, I'm almost certain that a bet will never get anyone to fold, and yet theres a whole lot of hands that "just call" down that dominate me( a 6, small flush, scared AA) Looking back at the hand, it seems like the only holdings that I would be getting value from would be JJ-QQ or a complete whack job with a naked A draw.

With two opponents who look determined to see a showdown, wouldn't a turn bet be a waste?

TomBrooks · #18 04-24-2005, 10:03 PM

Turn is an ugly 8 he most here. I figure im calling down at the most here...then they all check to me. Bet or no bet?

If one of them had bet, I would just call down. I've seen some guys at 1/2 bet the turn with only one opponent while still on a flush draw. Since they checked...

Bet. They may be as afraid of the flush as you are. Also, if one of them has a heart, you don't want to give him a free card to make a flush with. If you get checkraised, call it down. You have 4 outs to fill up.

TomBrooks · #19 04-24-2005, 10:09 PM

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River is a complete blank , 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
They both check to me again. Enough value in another bet here?

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I would say if one of them made the flush, they would have checkraised you on the turn. Go ahead and bet! Fire away with gusto, a flourish, and a lightness in your heart!