Defensive plays against super-agro players - What plays to use?

[DawnToDusk]

Still relatively new to the tournament scene but have been learning a great deal lately. I did recently play in a tournament where I ran into a super-agro player on my right who I think I play fairly well against. But it seems that my knowledge on defenssive plays comes from HoH:V1 on page 46-47 where he talks about The Hammer and the Rope-a-Dope. In the tournament most recently I employed the Hammer move (going over the top of the super-agro player) often. But aside from the Hammer and the Rope-a-Dope (where you encourage a super-agro to push you off a hand when you have genuine strength), what other moves/tactics do you employ against these super-agro players?

It seems my repertoire is lacking big time when playing these super-agro players. Any advice and wisdom is greatly appreciated.

A play I use alot is to check into them with a hand like top pair, let them make their bet, then put in a 3-4x reraise on them. It also helps for future hands against them when you are trying to hit your draw and don't want them pot betting just because you checked to him.

[DawnToDusk]

Seems like the Rope-a-Dope strategy, but you are obviously making a bet before the river to get them to check to you in the future when you have a draw.

But is that a strategy we really want to employ against a super-agro? Getting them to check to us when we have a draw? It seems like these are players we would want to target when our hands a really strong and a good holding. Wouldn't we rahter have them betting into us the whole way down and getting chips from them as opposed to making a draw say on the turn and river and trying to extract little money from them then?

Seems almost counter-intuitave to be playing a draw against them as you know they aren't going to be offering you the odds to play a draw if they are good super-agro players.

Personally, I like to be the guy who bets and raises, and hate being the person who is calling. Throw in a couple of big raises against them when they make their bets, and they become more hesitant to make bets without the goods, because they know at anytime I can come over the top of them and take that pot after they tried to take it from me. And I'd rather have the option of checking, making a continuation bet, or making a value bet when its my turn, if I am on a draw, I can keep the pot odds right for my hand if I control the betting, and if I check and they are used to me betting or check raising, SOMETIMES they will get suspicious when I got a well hidden draw (like a flop of Q97r holding JT) and give me a free card to hit my cards. They will still be aggressive, and start getting involved in plays to try to sucker me into reraising them so they can throw in another reraise over the top, but getting a free card on a draw that I wouldn't have gotten before is valuable to me.

So to answer your question, no, I don't like it when an opponent bets into me the whole way unless I have a monster that wouldn't have likely gotten any action otherwise, most of the time I'd rather be the one doing the betting and raising.

[DawnToDusk]

So far it seems like there are three strats that can be used against a super-agro (at least to my limited knowledge).

The Rope-a-Dope when you check your genuinely strong hand to the super-agro to encourage them to push you off it. The only raise you make in this hand is on the river.

The Hammer when you come over the top of a super-agro to make them fold their hand.

And a play that allows you to play a draw against a super-agro by having them check to you.

What else is out there that I don't know about? Any more info would greatly be appreciated.

[JeanieJ]

You're out there looking for certain things that will cure your problems against hyper *Ag* players. There aren't many, and even those that have special (corny) names (like the above mentioned) wont work as often as you'd like them to. Instinct comes at the top of the list. After an orb or two of playing with this person you'll get a feel for what they are doing (or trying to do). You'll get a pretty good read within that time and your play should go from there.

Every *Ag* player is different. Expecting the same strategies to work over and over against different people, would be insane. Do what you feel is right. After a little experience in tournament play, you'll know what to do. You wont need fancy names to tell you, because it'll come naturally. I know these days everything has a cool little nickname players like to use, and sometimes it'd be nice to have a little set of rules/plays we could learn that would help us beat any type of player... but the truth is, there are none. Use your instinct and experience. It will help you the most.

Good luck.

[DawnToDusk]

Thanks a bunch. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] Maybe I will start keeping a notebook of the super AG that I do play against so I can tailor my moves more to them. More instinctively agianst the ones I play over and over again at least.

But what if you are in like a big buy in tourney and a super AG just moved to your table and started to be the table captain? How is your play affected currently when you have no info on this super AG? Are you looking to defend your stack precariously? Are you looking only to play really strong hands if this super AG has entered the pot infront of you? Are you reraising immediately with your strong hands preflop if the super super AG has came in front of you?

Maybe a better question to ask right now is how are you playing if you are in early in a tournament and a super AG just got moved to your table? Are you looking to get in there and take his chips or just hope he doesn't get involved in any pots you are in?

My biggest troubles with super AG come in the beginning of tourneys.

[JeanieJ]

Wow that's a bundle of questions... let me see if I can answer what I can [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

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But what if you are in like a big buy in tourney and a super AG just moved to your table and started to be the table captain? How is your play affected currently when you have no info on this super AG?

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Generally I wont get myself involved unless I'm 90%-100% sure what type of player he/she is. This means sticking to your premium hands until you can get an good read on this seemingly LAG. For me it only takes an orb, two at the most to get a solid read on someone. Of course, they surprize you sometimes, but mostly you can get an accurate read within that amount of time.

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Are you looking to defend your stack precariously? Are you looking only to play really strong hands if this super AG has entered the pot infront of you? Are you reraising immediately with your strong hands preflop if the super super AG has came in front of you?


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Usually I like to play strong against *AG* players. If they're LAG it's even better. Most of the time they aren't folding preflop and if they hit any of the flop. I don't try to get too tricky, but that's just me personally.

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Maybe a better question to ask right now is how are you playing if you are in early in a tournament and a super AG just got moved to your table? Are you looking to get in there and take his chips or just hope he doesn't get involved in any pots you are in?


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In the early stages your main goals in MTTs should be a) to survive b) to gain as many chips as you can. This means you're taking chances against *L/AG* players. You have a good hand don't be afraid to put you chips in against a LAG. These are the players that build your stack and allow you to move far into the tournament with a comfortable chip stack.