KK - big pot and out of position

[Luke]

No siginificant reads on my opponents.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (8 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
UTG calls, 1 fold</font>, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, CO calls, Button raises</font>, i]1 fold[/i]</font>, Hero 3-bets</font>, UTG calls, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, CO calls, Button calls.

Flop: (14.40 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4 players)</font>
Hero bets</font>, UTG calls, CO calls, Button folds.

Turn: (8.70 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 3 players)</font>

Hero's plan for the turn and river?

[peterchi]

I dunno but someone should change your title to "Cool Hand"

I think I'd probably bet/fold though.

If we're just called, I'd check/fold the river... I can't imagine what hand that doesn't beat you would get all the way to the river, and bet it.

[Alex/Mugaaz]

Anyone check/fold the turn?

[Nick C]

What an uncomfortable spot. There is some chance you're ahead of QJ and JT or something, but I'm not too optimistic.

One problem is, if you bet, you're quite likely at least getting called again, by one player if not both, unless both of your opponents are scared of the flush.

If you bet and get raised, it's not as if you have an easy fold, with your murky gutshot and set outs, even though you could be drawing dead against a flush.

Ugh. I don't know. I think maybe I'd check, planning to call one but not two.

I find it very strange that there was no raise on the flop.

Any hand I can put UTG on which fits his preflop betting should either raise or fold. Conclusion: UTG probably is drawing or semidrawing- top pair plus draw (i say he has spade King + Ace).

If CO has a hand already, he shuld raise to give you the chace to rereaise to drive out UTG, so i conclude similarly.

Because none of these thigns happened, I think the spade 4 has you drawing dead or thin.

[W. Deranged]

I don't think betting is correct here. We have no protection value, will often get raised, may have some outs to win the hand, and are not vulnerable to overcards or anything like that. About the only reason we'd like to bet is to fold some weak spades, but there's likely a big spade or two out there anyway.

I check here, occassionally calling one against an agg. player if I think the pot will be heads-up or maybe three-way. I don't think there's a lot value in continuing past the turn here if many opponents seem interested in the proceedings.

[Luke]

In the actual hand I went ahead and bet the turn with a a plan of fold to a raise, check/call the river against a lone opponent and no spade falling, fold pretty much otherwise.

My feeling behind the turn bet was that I felt I had to protect against Tx, Qx, and a lone spade. But now I wonder how much protecting I need to do against Tx and Qx when they're likely kicker is a jack or king, and I have both of those "outs" covered.

Anyway, in the hand I bet and only UTG called. The river brought the wonderful J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] and of course I went ahead and bet again.

My opponent called and showed A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and MHWG.

Thanks for the comments.

Luke