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  #11  
Old 06-17-2005, 03:07 AM
-Skeme- -Skeme- is offline
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Default Re: Some Advice From Your Public Defender

Whatever you say, jailbird.
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  #12  
Old 06-17-2005, 03:10 AM
ThaSaltCracka ThaSaltCracka is offline
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Default Re: Some Advice From Your Public Defender

I agree, but unfortunately, many people no longer abide by certain things as ethics and principals. Its sad really, and a lot of the blame goes more on the system that puts a ton of cases on their schedule. Plus, they get paid jack [censored].
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  #13  
Old 06-17-2005, 03:15 AM
Malachii Malachii is offline
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Default Re: Some Advice From Your Public Defender

Wonderful observation there Skeme! You have amazing insight.
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  #14  
Old 06-17-2005, 10:50 AM
bennyk bennyk is offline
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Default Re: Some Advice From Your Public Defender

[ QUOTE ]
if you're going to be presumptuous enough to make your living intervening in the lives of others, you should at least bother being good at it.

[/ QUOTE ]

this person sounds like she's excellent at her job. she explains that she does what is possible given the circumstances. being realistic about what can be accomplished for a defendent can be the difference between getting a slightly-unfavorable plea bargain and losing in trial for a stiff minimum penalty.

being a public defender is a noble and selfless thing to do. to call it "presumptuous" is ridiculous. PD's aren't presuming to intervene in someone's life, they are ASSIGNED to clients in order to give them the protection that the law provides. think about it.
bk
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  #15  
Old 06-17-2005, 01:41 PM
nothumb nothumb is offline
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Default Re: Some Advice From Your Public Defender

[ QUOTE ]
this person sounds like she's excellent at her job. she explains that she does what is possible given the circumstances. being realistic about what can be accomplished for a defendent can be the difference between getting a slightly-unfavorable plea bargain and losing in trial for a stiff minimum penalty.


[/ QUOTE ]

First, it's impossible to tell if she's a good lawyer based on her comments about court conduct, appearance, etc. The things she discusses, such as plea bargains, technicalities, etc, are very common knowledge. This is not a mark of being 'good at her job.' My comments were about her professionalism (which is also part of the job).

Are you saying that telling an innocent defendant they have no chance to beat the charges and convincing them to do a 1-3 year bid in a dangerous NY state prison is better than doing your research and helping the person get off? No. Unfavorable plea bargains are not the exception, they are the norm. Usually they involve little to no legwork for the PD.

[ QUOTE ]
being a public defender is a noble and selfless thing to do. to call it "presumptuous" is ridiculous. PD's aren't presuming to intervene in someone's life, they are ASSIGNED to clients in order to give them the protection that the law provides. think about it.
bk

[/ QUOTE ]

I was speaking in general about public service, including social work and also public defense. It is indeed presumptuous. In social work, you presume you can do good things for a person, that you can set a positive example and make a difference in their lives. You'd be surprised how many social workers and child care workers don't take this seriously. Same thing for public defense. You are the last line of defense an indigent, frightened person has. Some people seem to think they deserve a medal just for showing up to a low-paying public service job. Who knows, maybe she just isn't good enough to get into private criminal defense? With her pessimistic attitude and self-important rambling, it wouldn't be a shock.

I know all about 'noble and selfless' work. The people who take it seriously and do it well deserve every bit of credit they get and more. The people who do it poorly are part of the reason we get so little credit in the first place, and there are plenty of people who would rather bitch and moan about their hands being tied, their pay being too low and their situation being unsurmountable than buckle down and do the work. They drag the rest of us down.

What good does posting this on craigslist do? Do you really think most crack dealers and car thieves are perusing the internet looking for a yard sale? No. This is an arrogant, frustrated person drawing attention to herself and trying to be smart and funny. It won't do any good for her clients and it will only contribute to the culture of hopelessness and resignation among rank and file public servants.

NT
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  #16  
Old 06-17-2005, 02:41 PM
on_thg on_thg is offline
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Default Re: Some Advice From Your Public Defender

[ QUOTE ]
You are the last line of defense an indigent, frightened person has.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you're a defense attorney, you're far more likely to be representing one of the people listed in the initial post, someone whose only real fear is of the consequenses of his/her actions.

A client who is actually innocent (as opposed to one who claims innocence but who has [censored] things up by leaving enough physical evidence, witnesses, etc to make actual innocence unlikely) is a rare bird.
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  #17  
Old 06-17-2005, 02:46 PM
bennyk bennyk is offline
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Default Re: Some Advice From Your Public Defender

[ QUOTE ]

First, it's impossible to tell if she's a good lawyer based on her comments

[/ QUOTE ]
yeah, ok

[ QUOTE ]

Are you saying that telling an innocent defendant they have no chance to beat the charges and convincing them to do a 1-3 year bid in a dangerous NY state prison is better than doing your research and helping the person get off?

[/ QUOTE ]

not exactly. i can't speak to the details of whether plea bargains are the norm or the exception.

[ QUOTE ]
I was speaking in general about public service, including social work and also public defense. It is indeed presumptuous.

[/ QUOTE ]

i guess we're going to have to agree to disagree about this one...it's hard for me to imagine that someone could be presumptuous by trying to help others. social workers and public defenders don't go knocking on people's doors looking to get in their lives, they come in when it is determined that someone needs their help.

obviously, we could argue about the metric that determines whether one needs the help of social workers, but i'd rather not. to a point it could be argued that it is presumptuous for people to decide that others need help.

[ QUOTE ]
You'd be surprised how many social workers and child care workers don't take this seriously. Same thing for public defense.

[/ QUOTE ]

you're probably right.

[ QUOTE ]
maybe she just isn't good enough to get into private criminal defense? With her pessimistic attitude and self-important rambling, it wouldn't be a shock.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, could be.

ok, you have made good points.
bk
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