KOTZ #12 PLHE Hand 1 of 2 -- Please help

AceKQJT · #1 08-20-2004, 09:32 PM

2nd Hand in the KotZ PLHE Event #12. I am assuming that all players are reasonable, as they are all 2+2ers (only 2nd hand of tourney, right?)

PokerStars (7 handed) converter

Preflop: AceKQJT (T-1500) is MP1 with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of T-10.
UTG (nottom, T-1500) calls T-20, AceKQJT raises to T-80, MP2 folds, CO folds, Button (lostchangi, T-1430) calls T-80, SB (poster) folds, BB folds, UTG (nottom) calls T-60.

Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (T-270, 3 players)
nottom checks, AceKQJT bets T-200, lostchangi folds, nottom raises to T-870

I'll give the action and reasons later. Please give some reasonable advice here.

--Casey

AceKQJT · #2 08-21-2004, 10:41 AM

.

Toro · #3 08-21-2004, 12:22 PM

I was at your table so I know what happened but it doesn't matter. I play it just as you did. Flopping sets don't happen often enough for me to give up on this hand.

I would say in similar situations for me it has only been about 50/50 that I've been behind in this type of hand. A lot of players will play back at you with 2 pair and even just top pair and some loose maniacs with a combination hand like one pair and a straight draw. And if he indeed has a straight, you've for some outs.

I'd rule out a higher set because he didn't come back at you pre-flop.

Hydro · #4 08-21-2004, 01:06 PM

I belive you have him beat, and no way am I folding this, I would put him all in there if he is not already all in.

You can rule out KK,QQ and he just limped in.
Only hands that beat you are A,10 and 10,9.

I would put him on 2 pair, KQ probably, I would think he would just call with the nut straight here..

Defenite call from me

joyride · #5 08-21-2004, 01:38 PM

I think you have him beat, too. His raise of double the pot screams "GET OUT OF MY POT, ALREADY!" If he'd made his straight, common sense would tell him to slow down a little and milk you for more, not win the t4xx pot right there. And, if he does have the straight, you've got outs.

*shrug*

If you can lay this down and think you'll have a better shot later, you're much better than I am.

AceKQJT · #6 08-21-2004, 02:29 PM

Here it is:

PokerStars (7 handed) converter

Preflop: AceKQJT (T-1500) is MP1 with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of T-10.
UTG (nottom, T-1500) calls T-20, AceKQJT raises to T-80, MP2 folds, CO folds, Button (lostchangi, T-1430) calls T-80, SB (poster) folds, BB folds, UTG (nottom) calls T-60.

Flop: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (T-270, 3 players)
nottom checks, AceKQJT bets T-200, lostchangi folds, nottom raises to T-870,

Well, I nearly ran my time out before acting here. My first thought was "there's no way he limped A-T UTG and then called that raise pre-flop." KK or QQ would've re-raised pre-flop. I think he has KQ (2 pr). So, what do I think he thinks I have? Having raised from EP pre-flop, he should've put me on AK, AQ, AA-JJ.

AceKQJT raises to T-1420 (All-in), nottom calls 550 (All-In).

When our cards were shown, I almost choked! I never even thought of that hand as a possibility (while playing the hand). DOH!

Turn: Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot:
Main Pot: > Pot won by AceKQJT ().

Results : 
nottom shows Tc 9c (straight, king high).
AceKQJT shows Jc Jd (full house, jacks full of queens).
Outcome: AceKQJT wins . 

It REALLY bothered me that I had made such a terrible read of my opponent. It also bothered me that I had gotten the majority of my chips in when I was behind.

Congrats on a GREAT finish Toro.

--Casey

Kirkrrr · #7 08-21-2004, 02:52 PM

There's not many hands that are beating you on this flop that would want to blow you right out with position, knowing you'll probably bet out on the turn and he can raise then... the only exception possibly being JT that flopped the low end and doesn't need another T. The more likely scenario is 'lost' put you on AK and flopped two-pair. Even if you are somehow behind, you have an excellent chance at a redraw. And if someone hit a higher set, well, it's just a bad day. I push.

Kirk R.

Kirkrrr · #8 08-21-2004, 02:57 PM

I think you are being unduly harsh to yourself on this one. There was only reasonable hand out there that you could be behind (as I mentioned in my post [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]), and he happened to have it. If you're going to hit your set and fold every time someone raises for fear of that one hand... well, you and I both know that such player's poker days are numbered.

Kirk R.

dogmeat · #9 08-21-2004, 04:50 PM

I just ran into almost the exact hand at a live table. I raised early with JJ and had one caller. Flop was KJT and I lead-off, then called the raise. Raiser shows me AQ - and I did't fill-up, so that's the way it goes. But I would call again in the same spot, especially when he raises on the flop with the straight, as I put him on 2 pair. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Dogmeat [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]