BB vs SB bigstack: facing flop mini-bet

[45suited]

I fold in spots like this, even though I have the better hand, I'd say, a majority of the time. My stack is fine, I just let it go and play good bubble poker. But I wonder, is raising FPS? This is a 22, and I can maintain a fine ROI just letting my hand go in spots like this, but still... Any thoughts on how to play the hand other than folding? Calling (just to see how serious he is) crossed my mind, but I didn't want to face two more bets and get bled by the bigstack. PP ($22)

Let's say the flop was Q-8-2 rainbow. (No draws.) I have the same hand (middle pair / weak kicker). Again, I have a decent stack vs the bigstack. He mini-bets. Anyone raise here, or do you just get out of the way?

UTG ( $745 )
UTG+1 ( $1535 )
CO ( $1470 )
Button ( $625 )
SB ( $2425 )
BB (HERO) ( $1200 )

Blinds(50/100)

Dealt to HERO [ 6c 8s ]
UTG folds.
UTG+1 folds.
CO folds.
Button folds.
SB calls [50].
BB (HERO) checks.

** Dealing Flop ** [ Jh, 8d, 5c ]
SB bets [100].
HERO folds.

[tigerite]

I fold as well here. I don't think there's a whole lot of point getting involved. Even though this is a low draw flop, if you call then he's still got the option on future streets of just folding when you're ahead or calling/raising when he's ahead.. making you commit more chips to the pot on his terms. When you have 11BB left, and good FE on the guys to act after you.. it's not the time to be going to war with him, I think.

I fold here as well. Your stack is comfortable enough to fold this and whatever cards come on the turn and river will scare you.

[45suited]

[ QUOTE ]
I fold as well here. I don't think there's a whole lot of point getting involved. Even though this is a low draw flop, if you call then he's still got the option on future streets of just folding when you're ahead or calling/raising when he's ahead.. making you commit more chips to the pot on his terms. When you have 11BB left, and good FE on the guys to act after you.. it's not the time to be going to war with him, I think.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the very type of hand why, in response to Dr Jeckyll's post where he pushed from the SB with 79o, I recommend calling, and betting any flop. The stacks are not deep enough for the BB facing even a mini-bet to get too frisky.

[wuwei]

I also fold. We just don't have enough room to manuever with our stack to get involved here.

[Dr_Jeckyl_00]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I fold as well here. I don't think there's a whole lot of point getting involved. Even though this is a low draw flop, if you call then he's still got the option on future streets of just folding when you're ahead or calling/raising when he's ahead.. making you commit more chips to the pot on his terms. When you have 11BB left, and good FE on the guys to act after you.. it's not the time to be going to war with him, I think.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the very type of hand why, in response to Dr Jeckyll's post where he pushed from the SB with 79o, I recommend calling, and betting any flop. The stacks are not deep enough for the BB facing even a mini-bet to get too frisky.

[/ QUOTE ]

One problem I feel like happens a lot is that when I bet people go over the top and I fold, when they bet and I go over the top they call... although this is usually pre flop. I will try it. Do you bet any textured flop since there was no pf raising?

[45suited]

[ QUOTE ]
One problem I feel like happens a lot is that when I bet people go over the top and I fold, when they bet and I go over the top they call... although this is usually pre flop. I will try it. Do you bet any textured flop since there was no pf raising?

[/ QUOTE ]

It depends on the opponent, stack sizes, blinds, the presence of a short stack, etc. But in your 79o post, I think against a typical opponent on the lower levels, a call followed by a mini-bet (200) will take down most pots. They're just playing survival much of the time (as they should be, that's the point). If the flop bet is called, give it up. Often, they'll be too afraid to bet the turn anyway, and you might back into the better hand by the end anyway. I'm just sayin' that it's better than pushing in the example that you gave. The whole risk / reward thing is way skewed when you push there.

[tigerite]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I fold as well here. I don't think there's a whole lot of point getting involved. Even though this is a low draw flop, if you call then he's still got the option on future streets of just folding when you're ahead or calling/raising when he's ahead.. making you commit more chips to the pot on his terms. When you have 11BB left, and good FE on the guys to act after you.. it's not the time to be going to war with him, I think.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is the very type of hand why, in response to Dr Jeckyll's post where he pushed from the SB with 79o, I recommend calling, and betting any flop. The stacks are not deep enough for the BB facing even a mini-bet to get too frisky.

[/ QUOTE ]

Absolutely, but in that hand, the BB had 8bb or something left, rather than the 11bb you have here, so it's a closer decision for me. I'm not really sure I'd want to piss about with 97o but I can see the reasoning behind it.

[45suited]

[ QUOTE ]
Absolutely, but in that hand, the BB had 8bb or something left, rather than the 11bb you have here, so it's a closer decision for me. I'm not really sure I'd want to piss about with 97o but I can see the reasoning behind it.

[/ QUOTE ]

Correct, there are differences (and it depends on your opponent), but I think you'd agree that my line (call, mini-bet) is much better than open pushing with 79o. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[durron597]

If I really think that the SB is making this play with any two cards, I would jam this flop. Sometimes he has me beat and I lose, but the vast vast vast majority of the time I pick up 300 chips.