Chip suicide, or standard play?

Logik · #1 12-02-2005, 03:15 PM

Only other hand that I have with this player is when he had AA and I had KK I bet, he raised, I three-bet, he just called, and I spiked my K and doubled through him. Other than that, he's usually an uber-fish, and he's most likely drunk. He hasn't won a pot in the last fifteen or so orbits, and has dropped about four buy-ins. He massively overbets sometimes when he has the nuts. He has LOOSE preflop calling standards, and is likely holding AT or A7, with or without the ace of hearts.

I have overbet bluff all in twice before and showed the pure air-- I did it against weak players who I knew would fold. I have not overbet with a real hand yet, and I have shown both bluffs. I have been doing somewhat decently, and the entire table is usually reluctant to play a big pot with me. The larger-stacked people have been avoiding me to pray on the fish that come, sit, get stacked, and leave.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

saw flop|saw showdown

UTG ($64.20)
MP ($40.05)
Button ($55)
Hero ($82.60)
BB ($25)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls $0.25, 1 fold, Button calls $0.25, Hero raises to $1.5, BB calls $1.25, UTG folds, Button folds.

Flop: ($3.50) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $2, BB raises to $5.25, Hero raises to $81.1, BB calls $18.25 (All-In).

beavens · #2 12-02-2005, 03:23 PM

standard for me.

.edit i'd lead for more on the flop, though.

ajmargarine · #3 12-02-2005, 04:10 PM

This isn't an overbet and it looks pretty standard.

Logik · #4 12-03-2005, 02:07 AM

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This isn't an overbet and it looks pretty standard.

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, given his stack size you're absolutely correct. I forgot he was the small stack at the table... rest of the table was pretty deep. Is nobody ever scared of the flopped flush here?

wdeadwyler · #5 12-03-2005, 02:13 AM

Bet more on the flop, at least 3. When he raises you, if youre ahead, all he needs is a pair and a heart to race you, so putting it all in on the flop is really bad IMO.

If you think you are ahead here, call, and donk all in on a heartless turn. If you think you are behind fold. He hasnt made a mistake if he has 10A with a heart by calling you, and if he flopped a set or a flush, you are either WB or drawing dead. I hate it.

Logik · #6 12-03-2005, 02:36 AM

[ QUOTE ]
If you think you are ahead here, call, and donk all in on a heartless turn. If you think you are behind fold. He hasnt made a mistake if he has 10A with a heart by calling you, and if he flopped a set or a flush, you are either WB or drawing dead. I hate it.

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If he has A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Tx he's actually ahead, but I know he is likely on a one-pair type hand, I just don't know if he has a heart to go along with it. Also, there's no possible way I can be drawing dead on this board at this time against any hand.

I still think this is a standard play, especially given his image. I do agree that potting it is better on this flop.

Logik · #7 12-04-2005, 10:07 PM

Results: A7o, no heart

Never underestimate the stupidity of 25NL-ers.

wdeadwyler · #8 12-04-2005, 10:37 PM

Yes, you could have runner runner hearts. This is not standard IMO, and is bad poker, this is a clear spot where you should wait for the turn where your equity edge is much higher to get your money in.

Logik · #9 12-06-2005, 05:39 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Yes, you could have runner runner hearts. This is not standard IMO, and is bad poker, this is a clear spot where you should wait for the turn where your equity edge is much higher to get your money in.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, there's absolutely no way I'm drawing dead.

If he holds A7 / AT with no heart (like he is), then most turns are a scare card for him, as it will likely be > a 7, but lower than an ace.

I think your thought process here is incorrect.

wdeadwyler · #10 12-06-2005, 05:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Yes, you could have runner runner hearts. This is not standard IMO, and is bad poker, this is a clear spot where you should wait for the turn where your equity edge is much higher to get your money in.

[/ QUOTE ]

Again, there's absolutely no way I'm drawing dead.

If he holds A7 / AT with no heart (like he is), then most turns are a scare card for him, as it will likely be > a 7, but lower than an ace.

I think your thought process here is incorrect.

[/ QUOTE ]

I meant you could have runner runner OUTS, not hearts.

As for my thought process, why is it correct. If villain is 50% to win on flop, and you put him in, he is not making a mistake to call, if villain is 30% to win on turn (these numbers are close but not exact), and you donkbet all in on a heartless turn, villain would be making a mistake to call. We gain when our opponent makes a mistake, and lose when doesnt. How is my logic wrong?