how'd I play this JJ?

madscratch · #1 07-02-2005, 11:10 AM

Cut-off is a bit of a maniac. Not much of a read on MP1 - she seems solid enough but maybe overplays just a bit.

I would have preferred the field to be narrowed more quickly, but even so I thought I was probably ahead when I was betting.

Any thoughts appreciated.

Party Poker 0.5/1 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
2 folds, MP1 calls, 2 folds, CO raises, 1 fold, SB calls, Hero 3-bets, MP1 calls, CO calls, SB calls.

Flop: (12 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, MP1 calls, CO calls, SB calls.

Turn: (8 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, MP1 calls, CO raises, SB folds, Hero calls, MP1 calls.

River: (14 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, MP1 checks, CO bets, Hero folds, MP1 calls.

Final Pot: 16 BB

Ortho · #2 07-02-2005, 11:13 AM

Turn call is good. River fold is terrible. Yes, there are a lot of ways you are beaten, but you're getting 15:1 on your 1-bet call. Co's a maniac, you say, so they could be betting a pair of 8s here for all you know...You still have an overpair.

kitaristi0 · #3 07-02-2005, 11:24 AM

I shudder at the thought of that river fold. A definite no-no with the pot that big.

madscratch · #4 07-02-2005, 02:00 PM

Yeah, the pot was big but I just thought I was no good once CO bet into me.

Thanks for the replies.

Results in below:
MP1 has Td Kc (one pair, tens).
CO has 9c 8c (flush, nine high).
Outcome: CO wins 16 BB.

Mathieu · #5 07-02-2005, 02:41 PM

grunching...

IMO, if you call the turn check raise you have to call the river bet. CO is representing 88, TT, but he could have picked up a Heart draw on 4th street and decided to take a shot. He's a bit of a maniac so we certainly don't want to make big laydowns against him.

You are getting 15-1 from the pot (16-1 if MP1 over calls with something ridiculous). You only need to be good here about 6% of the time. If MP1 check raises you can lay it down. MP1 has not acted yet, and it would be wrong to assume she has you beat.

Call and hope MP1 just calls as well.

Mathieu · #6 07-02-2005, 02:49 PM

Don't let the result mislead you. You said that you folded because you 'thought" you were beat, and that is terrible.

When the pot is that big you can't give it up because of a thought or suspicion. You need to be absolutely certain that you're beat. CO is a bit of maniac so you can't be absolutely sure that you're beat just because he showed some aggression.

madscratch · #7 07-02-2005, 03:39 PM

It's true that I probably do fold too many of these sorts of hands and I really don't like that sickening feeling when I see that I folded the winning hand.

Good advice.

Thanks all.

TomBrooks · #8 07-02-2005, 05:22 PM

TURN: Looks OK. CO might have made a set of Eights on the turn. Especially since he is a bit of a maniac though, he might have been overplaying a heart flush or OESD. Maybe he had a combination of the two and he was semi-bluffing.

RIVER: I don't like this fold. If he was on a flush draw, hearts seem more likely than clubs. If he was on a straight draw he might have made it, but it's worth a call for one more bet in this large pot. He could have been bluff betting a missed draw since you checked. He might have a read on you that you fold the river too much.

Edit after reading thread: Your fold was good here, but if CO is a thinking player, since he saw you lay this down, he may be more likely to try to bluff you next time when he misses. Try to be aware of your table image to help you predict how they are likely to play against you.