Paradise 0.5/$1 Full Ring- Hows my line?

[JP Rocks]

I’ve just come back to playing low limit HE. Our local casino has finally started dealing hold’em, so I’m just dusting off the cobwebs in my spare time. On a side note, the shape of the 4-8 and 5-10 games are pretty similar to the 0.5/$1 games I’m playing online. 5 or so players to every flop, and about 80% of hands go to a showdown.

Anyways, the table is pretty standard with 29/8 after about 90 hands. There are 3 players who are fairly tight passive and 3 guys who are really loose passive, and are just bleeding money (one of each is involved in the hand). If anyone can direct me to a pacific hand converter, that would be tops.

I’m in MP1 with 4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], UTG (54/10 after 81 hands) limps and I follow. MP2 (new player- 8 hands only, but has played 7 of them, raising preflop in 3 of those) raises, MP3 (20/3 after 73 hands) 3 bets, and its folded to UTG who calls.

Decision number 1) I was getting 5:1 odds to call here, and if MP2 capped and I called I was still getting 4:1. Odds of hitting a set are only 7:1, but this had the potential to be a monster pot, so I called.

MP2 caps, MP3 calls, UTG calls, I call. (17.5 SB)

Flop is 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Giving me an OESD and a weak BFD. I gave myself the 7 outs for the straight (counting the A and 6 of diamonds as 0.5 each), because the preflop action and the fact that I had 44 meant that someone else having a 4 was pretty unlikely. I didn’t give any out to the BFD or the other two 4s, because someone having an Ace was pretty damn likely.

UTG checks, I check, MP2 bets, MP3 raises, UTG calls.

Decision number 2) Am I going to see both cards, which may end up costing me $6 more big bets. If I and the 2 preflop raisers see it to the river with both rounds being capped, I’m putting in 5.5 more big bets. The pot at this stage has about 11 BB. If the flop and the turn gets capped, I’ll be putting in 5.5 BB to win 22BB, or getting about 4:1 (plus, if I hit the straight, a few more bets on the river). This gives me 4:1 implied odds when I have 7 outs twice, or 3 and change :1. I didn’t break out the calculator at the time, but my instinct told me that it was a close enough to call down, but I wasn’t confident enough to raise.

I call, and MP2 just calls. (12.75 BB)

The turn brings the A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], and UTG checked.

Decision 3) Bet here, or let the aggressors do my work for me? Also, the third flush card came down, although even if I think my hand isn’t good, the pot is way too big to fold my hand here.

I check, MP2 bets, MP3 folds, UTG calls, I raise, MP2 3 bets, UTG folds, I cap, MP2 calls.

River is the horrible J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], giving me a one card flush with the 4d, so I get ready to puke. I check, MP2 bets, I call.

Results to come later (including MP3’s hand). Any comments or questions about the hand are appreciated.

[DCWildcat]

Looks fine. What were you getting on the river? 900,000 to 1? Yeah, still good, even though you'll probably lose over 800,000 of those.

[Niediam]

1) SSH says you need 4 opponents to call once it is two bets back to you (p. 86-7) but I think 3 is perfectly fine if your opponents are especially aggressive.

2) Raise for value. You are approximately 33% to hit your hand by the river but you will only be putting in 25% of the money in. In addition, sometimes when you checkraise the flop and then check the turn your opponents will be scared to bet thinking you are going for another checkraise.

3)I play it the same.

[JP Rocks]

Thanks for the responses.

I dragged the pot with my weak, weak flush after MP2 showed A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], which really made my heart warm inside. Unfortunately, he left the table shortly after. MP3 said that he folded two black queens, which I thought was believable. He also had a few nasty things to say about me, but I just responded with "I was feeling lucky I guess", and turned the chat off.

[DCWildcat]

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2) Raise for value. You are approximately 33% to hit your hand by the river but you will only be putting in 25% of the money in. In addition, sometimes when you checkraise the flop and then check the turn your opponents will be scared to bet thinking you are going for another checkraise.


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This is a very good thought, but I think I'm still checking. I agree that we have 7 outs, using the OP's reasoning. This gives us around a 28% chance to hit our hand. The chance that MP2 folds when it's two back (unlikely), or that he caps and UTG folds with 2 back (also unlikely), plus redraws for boats for overpairs and sets, and flush opportunities, mean we don't really have 28% equity.

[Niediam]

Or sometimes you will hit a 4 and nobody will have an Ace... or you fill up on the river... or your aggressive play will get everybody to fold... or your hand is currently good and it holds up.

Easy raise for value. It's not really close.

[DCWildcat]

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Or sometimes you will hit a 4 and nobody will have an Ace...or you fill up on the river... or your aggressive play will get everybody to fold... or your hand is currently good and it holds up.

Easy raise for value. It's not really close.

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Literally every scenario there is FAR less likely than what I've posted. You've got a tiny edge at best, and a slightly larger deficit at worst. Even if you do have an edge, it's very close.

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Anyways, the table is pretty standard with 29/8 after about 90 hands.

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MP2 (new player- 8 hands only, but has played 7 of them, raising preflop in 3 of those) raises

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anyone else just fold preflop at the first option?

[JP Rocks]

I agree with DC- its probably a very close call in terms of EV, but the size of the pot means that I have to play on.

As a side note, I really dont think my pot equity is increased by either one or two people folding on the flop in this situation. I'm not buying any outs that I am confident in counting.

[Niediam]

The entire philosphy of playing good limit player is pressing small edges. [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] It's literally how you win at this game.