am i PC'ed here?

schwza · #1 08-30-2005, 03:18 PM

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (7 handed) converter

UTG (t740)
MP1 (t1250)
MP2 (t1745)
Hero (t940)
Button (t1355)
SB (t435)
BB (t1535)

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
3 folds, Hero raises to t150, 1 fold, SB raises to t435 (All-In), 1 fold, hero?

i have to call 285 more and there's 350 in dead money.

pooh74 · #2 08-30-2005, 03:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t50 (7 handed) converter

UTG (t740)
MP1 (t1250)
MP2 (t1745)
Hero (t940)
Button (t1355)
SB (t435)
BB (t1535)

Preflop: Hero is CO with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
3 folds, Hero raises to t150, 1 fold, SB raises to t435 (All-In), 1 fold, hero?

i have to call 285 more and there's 350 in dead money.

[/ QUOTE ]

yes...and bad raise PF.

Shilly · #3 08-30-2005, 03:24 PM

Just a quick question--do a lot of you try to steal in this spot?

Personally, I would just fold preflop. Now that you're getting 2 to 1, I think you have to make this call.

1C5 · #4 08-30-2005, 03:30 PM

The raise is fine, he could have folded if anyone else had reraised him.

This one I am not 100% convinced you have to call. Sure just based to the pot odds you do but look at your stack differences if you fold here compared to if you call and lose (and you will probably be behind most of the time if not all).

An argument could be made for folding I think. You call and lose, you are real short. You fold now and you still have a decent sized stack.

pooh74 · #5 08-30-2005, 03:41 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The raise is fine, he could have folded if anyone else had reraised him.

This one I am not 100% convinced you have to call. Sure just based to the pot odds you do but look at your stack differences if you fold here compared to if you call and lose (and you will probably be behind most of the time if not all).

An argument could be made for folding I think. You call and lose, you are real short. You fold now and you still have a decent sized stack.

[/ QUOTE ]

Whoa...so the raise is fine because if anyone ELSE besides the shortstack reraises he can fold. Then just after saying this you say that he should probably fold here as well. So how does raising 15% of your stack count as fine when you have absolutely no plan to call anything?

The only way I would categorize his PF raise as a good one if he was trying to induce a reraise from the SS. Not sure if QT is good enough for this play, but Im calling here in a heartbeat. I would never raise 3BB at this blind level with QT and a shortie behind, but, if I did, I'm gonna follow through on it.

1C5 · #6 08-30-2005, 03:44 PM

Well I just said how an argument could be made for folding to the small stack as well.

I may be talking out of my ass because I muck here all the time with that hand and that stack size so I have never been in this pickle before.

durron597 · #7 08-30-2005, 03:48 PM

I would fold BECAUSE I know an allin from the shorty would obligate me to call.

pooh74 · #8 08-30-2005, 03:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Well I just said how an argument could be made for folding to the small stack as well.

I may be talking out of my ass because I muck here all the time with that hand and that stack size so I have never been in this pickle before.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm sorry...just reread my post and I jumped down your throat.

Yes, thats my point...bad PF raise...but a bad play shouldnt be followed by another bad play....so you have to call this.

schwza · #9 08-30-2005, 03:53 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would fold BECAUSE I know an allin from the shorty would obligate me to call.

[/ QUOTE ]

but calling the shorty is preferable to folding. so i'd rather that the shorty pushed and i have an opportunity to make a +EV call rather than if anyone else pushes and i have to make a 0EV fold.

i think it's more right to say

[ QUOTE ]
I would fold BECAUSE I think shorty is gonna push a lot of marginal hands i'd rather he folded

[/ QUOTE ]

if shorty will ignore his short stack when he makes the decision to defend or not, his shortness makes me more inclined to raise, not less.

pooh74 · #10 08-30-2005, 03:59 PM

[ QUOTE ]
if shorty will ignore his short stack when he makes the decision to defend or not, his shortness makes me more inclined to raise, not less.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah, but is QTo the best choice given your stack? (plus the ever present danger of someone else "waking up")

-EV pf raise IMO