Q9s, big pot, how would you play this flop?

AaronS · #1 10-18-2005, 10:54 PM

Party Poker 2.00/4.00 Hold'em (10 handed) link

I've played about 2 loops at the table, opponents all seem loose

Preflop: Hero is MP3 with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 raises, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls, CO calls, 2 folds, BB calls, UTG calls.

too loose a flop call with 1 limper, the raiser, and 3 cold-callers?

Flop: (16.50 SB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (8 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, UTG+1 checks, UTG+2 bets, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero raises, CO folds, BB folds, UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls.

Obviously have to at least call here, getting about 19:1 with a gutter and backdoor flush draw... Raise to get a free card/pick up some outs? (admittedly queens might not be outs here) Just call?

Turn: (12.25 BB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
UTG+2 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, Hero checks.

Anyone bet here with the double gutter?

River: (12.25 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
UTG+2 checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, Hero checks.

any other comments?

Final Pot: 12.25 BB.

bobhalford · #2 10-19-2005, 12:34 AM

Maybe I'm nute but I would never cold call a preflop raise with a Q in my hand, much less Q9s. I fold KQs here too.

Harv72b · #3 10-19-2005, 12:49 AM

Folding any suited connector (including 2-gappers) here would be a mistake. Hero has position on the PFR and a ton of players involved in the pot (and you can pretty much guarantee that BB will come along); the immediate odds are too great to pass up, let alone the implied ones.

I like flat calling the flop. If you hit your gutter you'll be holding the nuts, and with the pot this big you're not chasing anyone who flopped a pair (i.e., QJ) out with a raise. So I don't think you buy any additional outs (even T7 would still be correct to call 2), and I'm frankly shocked that you got even 1 free card out of the raise, let alone 2.

matt hooley · #4 10-19-2005, 09:44 AM

fold PF, every time.
on the flop I just call. your draw is to a very strong hand that can win many times though you are multi-way. raising will just knock out players that may find a second best hand to call the turn or river with in such a big pot. I don't really see a flop raise for value

@bsolute_luck · #5 10-19-2005, 10:01 AM

preflop: fine
flop: just call. your draw isn't that strong and you risk getting 3-bet by a better hand that you're calling to at least the turn anyways making this an expensive flop for such a weak hand.

turn: no don't bet. you're not getting a J, TT-99 to fold (at least i don't think you would).

olavfo · #6 10-19-2005, 10:11 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I fold KQs here too.

[/ QUOTE ]
That's a mistake. KQs plays very well multiway.

Joe Tall · #7 10-19-2005, 10:15 AM

Fold preflop. You are going to be paying too much to see the flop with what is likely a very dominated hand in addition to the fact that there are many to act behind.

Your raise on the flop is fine with reads. You can clean up your outs from the front flop checkers by raising versus players unlikely to 3-bet that check the turn, all for a raise.

#8 10-19-2005, 10:22 AM

I'd fold preflop. 78s plays very well in a multiway raised pot. Q9s doesn't. Since you chose that course, I would call the flop, but I think you have to fold pf.

#9 10-19-2005, 03:53 PM

I usually don't like to play a hand like Q9s behind a raise. If I had played the hand, I would have flat called the flop and check/called the turn.

BigBiceps · #10 10-19-2005, 03:59 PM

1. fold preflop
2. do not raise the flop with only 4 outs with 8 people in the pot