Was this game crooked?

[rgschackelford]

Hi there,

I'm a little upset with myself right now, not because I lost, but because I think I got myself into a crooked game. Let me describe what happened:

I'm at a hotel, and I was in the hot tub, talking with a few people who were passing through as well. We were talking about tourist spots in the Dakotas, and the Black hills, then we got into discussions about card games. I asked them if they play hold 'em, and they did. One of the guys deals a fake casino, where he says he picked up a lot of stuff from low-limit players. Well, I go up to my room, change, grab some cards and money. The buy-in was only $10, but this is more important than just the money here. I show up, and there are only two of the three going to play, and they brought their own deck. I asked if we were playing with cuts (cuts can slow the action). The first few hands I get junk. One hand, I got KJ, and the guy raised, so I decided, that even three handed the gap concept dictates I fold. I was right, because he was betting pocket tens. We get to one hand, where I had a Q9, and it was raised the minimum by the dealer, the small blind called, and I called (getting 5-to-1 odds on my money). The flop comes J-2-5. The first guy checks, so I decide a probe bet is in order, and fire $1 into the pot ($3). I get one call and a fold. The turn brings a T, so now I have an open ended straight draw, so I semi-bluff $2, and the guy pushes all in for his $3. Getting 9-to-1 odds on my money and about 5-to-1 on my money, I make the call, and he flips up AKo. Now I can win with a K, 8, or 9 (my Q gives him Broadway). I river an 8, and scoop the pot.

I'm playing heads up with this guy, get 77, raise, and he folds. Two hands later, I get QQ. I raise $2, he reluctantly calls. The flop comes A-K-Q, two clubs. Heads up, I've got a monster. I bet another $2 (trying to make it look as if I'm stealing), he jokes with his buddy, and then calls. The turn is a Tc. This is where I made the biggest mistake, because I started to panic that someone with two clubs or a J has me beat. I think what are the odds he has that, what are the odds he'd fold to an all-in, and all the other important factors (knowing that I have a 10 out redraw if I'm behind to a straight or flush). I push all-in, and he calls. He turns over JT. Is it likely that we'd have these two hands, and that we'd both flop monsters? I should have proceeded with caution on the turn, but I figured that even heads up I'm probably still ahead, and he probably has maybe a pair or two. The river bricks out on me as he delivers a 9. I shake his hand (as is customary), and we talk for a few minutes, before they decide to head back to their room. Before leaving the offer me a "beer for the road", which I decline. I eavesdrop a little on their room, and they were discussing my play with the open-ended straight. I leave, in fear of one of them opening their door, and catch me in the act.

All in all, these guys were nice guys. I just can't help but think that that last hand (dealt by the other guy) was a little bit more than coincidental.

So, I'm asking you if you think this game was crooked. If so, why? If not, why? If not, then let me know how I could I have played that last hand differently, or was I just destined to lose all of my money? Should I have gotten my money in on the flop, not giving him a chance to draw to a J, T, or club, had he had that kind of hand? Anyway, just send me you thoughts, and I thank you very much.

RGS

[Josh W]

I may be wrong, but I think you'll get flamed for this post. I hope I'm wrong because you are asking a sincere question and deserve sincere answers.

First off, it's amazingly unlikely that 3 (or 2) guys are gonna work to scam you outta $10.

With the last hand, monster vs. monster happens all the time. But if the deck was setup to take you down, there wouldn't have been such a scare card on the turn. The flop would have come Q98, with a 2 and 3 on the turn and river, neither completing a flush.

[Leonardo]

With all due respect, you just wasted a lot of peoples time with a stupid post. No, the game was not crooked. What at all is crooked? You flop trips when a straight was there and he had it. So what? Next time you get dealt pocket Q's and someone has pocket A's and you get busted are you going to complain too?

[Reef]

it's fricken $10!!

bad all in on the turn w/ QQ

[bennyk]

[ QUOTE ]
With all due respect, you just wasted a lot of peoples time with a stupid post. No, the game was not crooked. What at all is crooked? You flop trips when a straight was there and he had it. So what? Next time you get dealt pocket Q's and someone has pocket A's and you get busted are you going to complain too?

[/ QUOTE ]

he didn't waste anyone's time. if you feel your time has been wasted, try the following:

1) don't read posts that you feel will be a waste of your valuable time.

2) don't take up your valuable time responding in an off-topic manner to posts that you have already determined to be a waste of your time.

thank you,
bk

[RRRRICK]

An elaborate scam for 10 bucks, I don't think so.
They even offered you a beer. That's gotta be worth 3 bucks or so. What's the point in cheating someone out of $10.00 if you are going to offer them a beer.

[sully4321]

[ QUOTE ]
An elaborate scam for 10 bucks, I don't think so.
They even offered you a beer. That's gotta be worth 3 bucks or so. What's the point in cheating someone out of $10.00 if you are going to offer them a beer.

[/ QUOTE ]

bingo. you weren't scammed. just bad luck.

[Dov]

[ QUOTE ]
One hand, I got KJ, and the guy raised, so I decided, that even three handed the gap concept dictates I fold. I was right, because he was betting pocket tens.

[/ QUOTE ]

You clearly have no idea what poker is about.

I don't mean to be rude, but you really don't understand the game.

First of all, this is a reraise (KJ).

Secondly, what if he had KT? It doesn't matter what he had. If you don't understand this, then start reading some older posts.

[ThinkQuick]

No I don't think they were hustling you but I also don't think it's a problem for you to be suspicious. You should however, ask for a cut instead of complaining after you lost.

I was riding a train in Ontario once, and two 17yr old kids across the aisle whip out some chips and cards and start talking pretty loud about how much fun texas hold'em is. I knew the guy sitting facing them from Alberta, and he's never even heard of hold'em but he's interested. The friends convince him that he has to play for money but he gets them down to $10. A few hands in, one guy goes all in on the flop with a flush draw and the second calls with middle pair. No improvement and its now a 2:1 chip ratio against the Albertan. Now the wheels are spinning here.. did they plan to just dump chips to one or the other then have the chip leader easily crush the sucker? Do they rig the deck (no cuts)?

I soon decided by the caliber of the kid's play that this was no hustle, but I guess it could easily have been. What was a little strange was that the Albertan never even thought about it. Just played, eventually lost his $10, and skipped on the tab when he changed trains in Toronto.

[rgschackelford]

First off, it's not that I lost the money. The principle was that if it were a rigged hand, I didn't see it coming. If it's a bad beat, so what, that's poker. I can take that. I just got this little inkling, this instinct that they were trying something, but I probably am wrong. I sorry to "waste time", I just didn't know where to ask about this, and I thought that some people in a "theory" forum might know a little about scam games. Thanks for all your advice, and have a good one.

RGS

P.S. I folded the KJ because I decided I'd play tight to see how these guys play, and what hands they'll check/raise/fold/call with. Later in the game, I would have made a play with it.