Midpairs in lvl 4 w/ 13-20BB

[johnnybeef]

you bet too much on both streets, but i play the same way otherwise.

[helpmeout]

Checking the flop is too weak you cant just give freecards away like that. He might have called with something like KQ or AQ.

This is why I prefer a 1/4-1/3rd of the pot bet its enough for him to get away from. Also looks like a trapping bet from an overpair.

[suited_ace]

Yeah, nevermind the flop. I hate my flop bet, I should've checked and gone from there. My question was more PF.

[suited_ace]

How much do you bet PF?

[Fatdogs12]

Why bet anything? You have 17bbs. You don't need this hand right now. If you want to fish around for trips thats fine but what else are you trying to get out of this?

If you flop overcards are you gonna be willing to push? I doubt it, so why bother? Fold preflop or call for set value.

[bigt439]

[ QUOTE ]
I've been wondering if this is not a fold PF w/ 88-TT, maybe even JJ...

[/ QUOTE ]

Dude, I've heard you've been running bad, and maybe that's part of why you're saying these things, but if you're honestly saying stuff like this then this can't be your only significant leak. Not trying to be a dick at all, but we come here to help examine our games and you really need to not be thinking things like this. Folding JJ here? Pushing would be more +EV.

I think I understand you're frustrated, but folding here with any of those hands would be so ridiculous. They hold so much more than set value. Anyways, your pf raise is fine, maybe make it to like 275 or 250, but 300 is fine. Your flop bet is WAY too big. Bet 1/3 to 1/2 the pot. When you're dealing with such a large absolute value of chips and relative value in terms of chips in play, the relative value in relation to pot size becomes much less of a factor. Regardless, I don't know what limit this is, but I recall you playing small and your opponents don't have "half a brain" so don't worry about them reading you as weak. I play the 55's and 109's and I don't think these bets are ridiculous to make. Hell on that drawless board that's the bet I make with an actual hand. Folding to his allin just becomes a function of his play up to that point, but you should have a plan when you make that bet. Check raising all in is a viable plan too.

[suited_ace]

Yeah, I'm seeing *way* too many ghosts under my bed, but posts like this help me concentrate on the stuff I know I need to work on and not worry about this.

I've been checking up almost every aspect of my game in the last days. Sorry for the useless posts, but to me they're absolutely valuable - I'm affraid you're gonna see a few more this week.

As for the hand in question, the more I look at it, the more I like the idea of C/R all-in on the flop.

But let's say I check and he checks behind. What is your plan for the turn?

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
you bet too much on both streets, but i play the same way otherwise.

[/ QUOTE ]

agree. i make it 250, then 400 into the 750 pot.

[schwza]

if you fold JJ there (or even 88), i'll smack you.

[bigt439]

[ QUOTE ]
But let's say I check and he checks behind. What is your plan for the turn?

[/ QUOTE ]

First of all, no worries man. I don't think any post is really too simple or too obvious to be made if it will help you out with a situation you're unsure of. The only reason I took such a definitive tone is because of how important it is you stop thinking like this. But hey, if you need people to say it for it to really hit home, keep posting these.

As for whether to check raise or bet, it really depends on the opponent. If he's been betting everything checked to him, I'd go for the check-raise, but if you can comfortably gain information from his flop action if you bet, then go ahead and do that. My default would probably be to bet against an unknown, but I check raise alot in this spot too.

If he checks the flop you should be betting any turn for 1/3-1/2 the pot. You probably had the best hand on the flop, therefore it's still very likely you still do. Bet out and go from there, but I'd be wary of a raise because it could be a slowplayed J.