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  #11  
Old 12-28-2005, 04:40 PM
Shillx Shillx is offline
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

Well there are 6 combos of KK and just 1 KQ [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], so it is 6:1 against him having KQ [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. In reality he could have various different underpairs (KK/JJ/TT/99), but it is tough to differentiate between them so I just picked KK as the lucky hand.

I don't know if A8s is a possible hand, but I omitted it when he raised preflop. I don't know much about 6-max ranges so it could still be a viable hand. If it is, the odds go down that he actually holds it when he just calls the flop raise. IMO any Ax hand that raises preflop is making it 3-bets on the flop, so I eliminated all top pair hands when he just called.

Q8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] is not a good hand to raise from the SB. He would have to be getting out of line to include that into his range. It is also just one combo and that makes it far less likely then something like KK or JJ.
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  #12  
Old 12-28-2005, 04:40 PM
Vote4Pedro Vote4Pedro is offline
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

Why not? He mentioned that he was playing pretty loose PF, and I dont see him having an ace. The button's autobet tendencies would allow him to C/R and push jason off of a better hand and get HU with the autobettor
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  #13  
Old 12-28-2005, 04:57 PM
Disconnected Disconnected is offline
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Seems like QQ or KK to me.

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I don't know why he checked the turn with QQ, if that were to check through it would have been terrible. And the river would have been auto-auto bet. KK seems like a possibility, where he is most likely behind on the flop with one of the two coldcallers having an ace. So if KK gets checked through on the turn it is not bad since you are already behind and maybe he can fold a weak ace with the turn c/r while punishing the flush draw. This is my reasoning right now, but I am on percocet and a little dizzy/not thinking straight so this could sound a little messed up right now

[/ QUOTE ]

Just trying to put him on more than one hand. With QQ, you're right he could also bet out, but there's also a decent chance someone is betting this street based on BB raising the flop and the read on button as a probable bettor if it gets checked to him.

As an aside, is KK a clear river bet? I think it's a bet, since Qx will pay off, but I wonder if between busted draws not paying off and the possibility that a weak ace got scared with all the action if a river bet with KK is close.
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  #14  
Old 12-28-2005, 05:01 PM
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

[ QUOTE ]
I don't know if A8s is a possible hand, but I omitted it when he raised preflop. I don't know much about 6-max ranges so it could still be a viable hand. If it is, the odds go down that he actually holds it when he just calls the flop raise. IMO any Ax hand that raises preflop is making it 3-bets on the flop, so I eliminated all top pair hands when he just called.

[/ QUOTE ]

Having played this game quite often, I think A8 is definately in (and should be in) Hero's preflop raising range in this game.

I agree that the chance of it goes down when Hero just calls the flop raise, however given the action presented to Hero, I believe calling might be better than 3-betting. Since the flop raiser is immediately to his left, simply calling the flop in hopes to raise the field on a non-club turn might have been the best line for Hero's A8 ... the non-club part being the key for me. I liken it to the TT on a 9xx board where your hand is likely good, but very vulnerable. If your relative position is advantageous, then wait & exploit it after a safe turn.

What do you think?

Edit:
Forgot the large PPs. I remove these from Hero's range when I see the turn check/raise. When Hero's raised on the flop & the third guy cold calls, he should think there's a good chance one of the villain's has an A. It's unlikely both are on flush draws, and given Ax is a 6-max magnet for many players, I think the turn check-raise is dubious. If BB has the A, it's got a weak kicker, so there's a chance of folding him. But, given these guys are friends & play back at each other all of the time, I think that isn't happening. The turn bettor isn't folding an A, as it's only one back to him, and I don't believe either Villain would fold a flush draw here.

So, I dismiss high PPs from Hero's range...
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  #15  
Old 12-28-2005, 05:03 PM
Disconnected Disconnected is offline
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

[ QUOTE ]
Well there are 6 combos of KK and just 1 KQ [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], so it is 6:1 against him having KQ [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. In reality he could have various different underpairs (KK/JJ/TT/99), but it is tough to differentiate between them so I just picked KK as the lucky hand.

I don't know if A8s is a possible hand, but I omitted it when he raised preflop. I don't know much about 6-max ranges so it could still be a viable hand. If it is, the odds go down that he actually holds it when he just calls the flop raise. IMO any Ax hand that raises preflop is making it 3-bets on the flop, so I eliminated all top pair hands when he just called.

Q8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] is not a good hand to raise from the SB. He would have to be getting out of line to include that into his range. It is also just one combo and that makes it far less likely then something like KK or JJ.

[/ QUOTE ]

Do you think QQ is a possibility? I only thought about it since the OP had a hint that he should have bet the river and a read on button that button would bet if checked to. I thought one possibility is that Rob was trying for a c/r on the river, since many hands that would pay off a river bet would also bet if checked to. FPS on my part?
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  #16  
Old 12-28-2005, 06:51 PM
TredWel TredWel is offline
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

I'm thinking AJ, maybe KK.
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  #17  
Old 12-28-2005, 06:58 PM
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
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  #18  
Old 12-28-2005, 08:28 PM
thejameser thejameser is offline
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

[ QUOTE ]
7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

no, no. 7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
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  #19  
Old 12-28-2005, 09:23 PM
DavidC DavidC is offline
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Qxc?

[/ QUOTE ]

Nah. It could be KQ [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], but the sheer lack of combinations makes it less likely. I don't think it is getting 3-bet on the flop though so it is still a possible hand. Put more players in there and there is no way it could be Qx [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

I would guess KK with a lot of certainty. In fact, I'd lay 6:1 that it is KK. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Edit - Jason has a busted flush draw and the other dude probably has some kind of missed draw though it is hard to say.

[/ QUOTE ]

Kinda curious here, why would Jason iso-raise vs Entity when he has a fourflush?
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  #20  
Old 12-29-2005, 10:45 AM
jason_t jason_t is offline
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Default Re: Hand from a 6-max table -- handreading.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Qxc?

[/ QUOTE ]

Nah. It could be KQ [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], but the sheer lack of combinations makes it less likely. I don't think it is getting 3-bet on the flop though so it is still a possible hand. Put more players in there and there is no way it could be Qx [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

I would guess KK with a lot of certainty. In fact, I'd lay 6:1 that it is KK. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Edit - Jason has a busted flush draw and the other dude probably has some kind of missed draw though it is hard to say.

[/ QUOTE ]

Kinda curious here, why would Jason iso-raise vs Entity when he has a fourflush?

[/ QUOTE ]

If I fold the rest of the field I have a better chance of winning the pot without improving to a flush.
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