Flop set, Ace hits turn, what next??

[Wes ManTooth]

SNG NL, (9 handed) converter

Hero (t800)
MP1 (t770)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
Hero calls t15, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP1 calls t15, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, Button calls t15, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t50) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">MP1 bets t30</font>, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds, Hero calls t30.

Turn: (t110) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>

I am first to act what would you do? discuss

I will have another question shortly, explaining my actions and the river.

[citanul]

with a crowd that large, i'd have led the flop, since as doyle says, leading out with a set gives you the best chances to get all in on the flop with the likely best hand.

with the ace coming on the turn first to act, having led the flop, leading the turn again is nice, as someone who called you with an ace on the flop will often raise you here. checkraising becomes less viable as you move up in stakes i find. and, someone without an ace will sometimes (rarely i guess) bluff raise you here.

having not led, it gets trickier, because you betting out suddently looks like you were trying to catch the ace, and did. i'd probably still lead out anyway, the pot is still small, and your job is thus to make it big, so that when you win it, you'll be happier than if it was small.

citanul

[Wes ManTooth]

[ QUOTE ]

with the ace coming on the turn first to act, having led the flop, leading the turn again is nice, as someone who called you with an ace on the flop will often raise you here. checkraising becomes less viable as you move up in stakes i find. and, someone without an ace will sometimes (rarely i guess) bluff raise you here.


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Assuming I led the flop, what size bet would you lead the turn with? a weak beat? strong? what percentage of the pot would you consider beating?

Thanks for your input

[citanul]

if i'd led the flop, it would have been most likely for 50. with one caller, i'd then have a pot of 150, and my opponent covered, him with about 700 behind.

when leading the flop, i'd lead probably just about 100, maybe 125. i wouldn't want to overbet the flop in any way here. part of the idea is to make it look like a value bet, but also look like a bet you could fold if you were raised, and look well, the same as all your other bets. i might even bet about 75. from there you can choose your line if raised. depending on the raise size, some people like to try to get in a stupid sized raise less than all in, go straight all in, or try to call and then lead the river.

personally i like the bet of about 100 for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is that when the guy raises to 300, he's usually just screwed. if the guy had fewer chips, say, 500, this would be even better, especially as an opportunity to throw a weak lead out there, since your opponent will often try to push you off a pot while drawing dead.

as i have mentioned before, having your opponent try to push you off a pot while they are drawing dead (and apparently it's not the bubble in the mirage 2000 event) is basically my favorite moment in poker. especially in spots like these when you know for sure that they are trying to make a move, because that's what you told them to do.

citanul

ps: i didn't make it as clear as it could be, but the strategy for flopping a set on a non-scary board clearly varies greatly based on preflop action, position, stack depths, and number of opponents, and other stuff.

[Wes ManTooth]

[ QUOTE ]

ps: i didn't make it as clear as it could be, but the strategy for flopping a set on a non-scary board clearly varies greatly based on preflop action, position, stack depths, and number of opponents, and other stuff.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for all the comments, this is partly what i was putting into consideration.

I will continue with the hand that played out...
Since I did check call the flop and since an Ace hit the turn...
(I know you may not like this) but I decided to check the turn. I was hoping that villian, will bet out again, But I also planned ahead of MAYBE even checking on whatever came on the river, regardless if he bet or folded. Therefore giving the villian two chances to attempt to steal the pot.

Villian decided check the turn.

River was the Queen (Hearts) so the backdoor flush draw got there and also put up straight possiblities. From his flop bet I put him on he either had an overpair and/or top pair or 2 pair. So I was not worried about him having a straight. Though the flush did get there I was not concerned about this either, for a number of reasons, which would be a long discussion in its self (I will try not to go off topic).

Before I post the final results, I am curious on what you would now do?
On the river would you check? bet? how much would you bet even though the pot size is 110 and unfortunately relatively small?

Any comments?

[zambonidrivr]

i would lead with a bet that does not allow some complete shmuck to draw to a flush

[Wes ManTooth]

[ QUOTE ]
i would lead with a bet that does not allow some complete shmuck to draw to a flush

[/ QUOTE ]

Assumed that you did check the turn, what play would you take if you were first to act on the river and the draw did hit??
refer to my previous post.

Any comments are welcomed and appreciated.
Thanks again

[wh1t3bread]

Since I smell a bad beat it sucks that he had KJ.

P.S. Don't slow play flopped sets.

[flo]

I lead the flop and check the turn, because i had a good hand on the flop but i don't like the ace. Someone with a strong ace will bet into you, maybe even someone with a weak ace or with no ace at all. I move if that happens.

[curtains]

I just hate the ultra slowplaying on the flop. It's a perfect way to make as little as possible in such a hand IMO.