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#31
11-18-2005, 01:20 PM
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Re: KQo Checkup
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (8 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, Button calls, SB calls, BB calls. Flop: (8 SB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font> SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, Button calls, SB folds, BB calls. Turn: (7 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font> BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, Button calls, BB folds. River: (9 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises</font>, Hero folds. Final Pot: 12 BB Standard right? What if villain is fishy? What if he's very good? [/ QUOTE ] I'm mostly worried if this guy is a solid player. If he's solid, the turn call makes sense (looking for an overcall from BB). If he's less than solid (your words: fishy), I think I make this call. Poorer players aren't going to think "let me get that overcall", they're going to jump out of their seats about hitting their draw and try to jam the pot. I think a poorer player raises this turn. The fact that he didn't makes this river fold vs. call read-dependent, IMO. [/ QUOTE ] How correct is Villain going for an overcall here with only one other opponent? Hero raised preflop and on the flop. Going for the turn overcall, why risk the BB not calling and losing us a BB? We're fairly certain Hero will call the raise with all the action he's given so far. Villain raising should gain an extra 1BB, while if the BB calls gives us the same 1BB. But if the BB folds we lose the 1BB. ~ 
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#32
11-18-2005, 01:29 PM
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Re: KQo Checkup
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[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] SSH say limp with KQo in early postion.... But what do i know i am still new [/ QUOTE ] Me aggro 2p2 me like hand me raise. Me lose money doing so. [/ QUOTE ] FYP [/ QUOTE ] That's one of the worst FYP's in a long time. KQo is an easy raise for me in almost all positions and the vast majority of good LHE players I know. Rob
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#33
11-18-2005, 01:44 PM
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Re: KQo Checkup
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I hate your flop move. You make a critical error by raising the flop, and it will cost you the pot a lot of the time. Call this flop bet and raise any safe turn card. When you raise the flop, you offer the players to your left 5.5:1 on a call, and will inflate the pot such that the turn there will be no way to shut out draws with 6-7 outs or more, which is to say most draws. [/ QUOTE ] are you serious? he raises flop with TP/TK and its a mistake?
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#34
11-18-2005, 01:46 PM
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Re: KQo Checkup
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The only draw I'm worried about is a flush draw. Theres no way we can defend against it by calling the flop and raising the turn as they'll still be getting sufficient odds [/ QUOTE ] exactly ,calling this flop with kq here is very very weak and sad [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]
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#35
11-18-2005, 03:15 PM
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Re: KQo Checkup
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Postflop, I hate your flop move. You make a critical error by raising the flop, and it will cost you the pot a lot of the time. Call this flop bet and raise any safe turn card. When you raise the flop, you offer the players to your left 5.5:1 on a call, and will inflate the pot such that the turn there will be no way to shut out draws with 6-7 outs or more, which is to say most draws. [/ QUOTE ] This is madness, pure madness. One of the easiest flop value raises in the history of poker. Why even play hands like KQ if you can't value bet/raise a Qxx flop? Don't worry about "giving flush draws improper odds". You can't unless it's HU. Get their $$$ while they're drawing. If button held the nut flush draw, he missed an easy flop 3-bet anyway... I thought Hero played this fine, though I can see an agrument for check-calling the river vs a tricky opponent if we really need to show down. Tom
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#37
11-18-2005, 06:27 PM
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Re: KQo Checkup
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I also think waiting till the turn to raise a safe card may be better because you get bad players to call big bets on draws they're only 20% to make. Want to hear more discussion on this issue. [/ QUOTE ] There is no guarantee that flush draws will bet the turn UI.
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#38
11-18-2005, 06:45 PM
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Re: KQo Checkup
flop raise is standard and mandatory imo, you must protect your hand.
why are people so quick to be afraid of flush draws anyway? river fold seem very weak. I value bet and call a raise against an unknown getting 12-1. could someone expalin why so many people like the fold here? how can you give up this pot claiming to know villian has you beat 92.4% of the time?
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#39
11-18-2005, 06:54 PM
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Re: KQo Checkup
i read this whole thread mistaking the flop play for the pre-flop play, so i thought you were 3betting an UTG raise from an unknown and that nobody said anything about it. my world was caving n for a minute there.
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