big fold on the river

future · #1 06-17-2005, 03:50 PM

Not a hand of mine personally, but of someone I was observing. I liked the action but maybe check the river? Comments? *NOTE: 5.50 BUYIN*

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t100 (6 handed) converter

UTG (t2930)
MP (t855)
CO (t2220)
Button (t820)
SB (t4288)
Hero (t2387)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
2 folds, CO calls t100, 2 folds, Hero checks.

Flop: (t250) 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets t150, CO calls t150.

Turn: (t550) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets t100, Hero raises to t350, CO calls t250.

River: (t1250) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets t500, CO raises to t1620, Hero folds.

Final Pot: t3370

mlagoo · #2 06-17-2005, 03:59 PM

terrible. what hand was it that was made on the river that called all the way down like that? the only possibility really is something like K8 or 88, but the chances of that are so low, i'm calling every time here.

future · #3 06-17-2005, 04:10 PM

Since you're so sure of yourself I'll tell you he had 6h7h.

jcm4ccc · #4 06-17-2005, 04:15 PM

The turn play is awful. The hero was the flop bettor. There was no reason to think that a check-raise would work here. If the CO is working on a draw, hero is just giving him a free card.

Luckily the CO bet the turn. But then the hero only raised him 250 in a pot of 1000 chips, giving him the odds to call.

It was the turn play that made the river play so difficult.

Matt R. · #5 06-17-2005, 04:17 PM

Good fold. I'd raise more on the turn -- at least t500. The river bet is read dependent. I'd bet if you think he'd call with a weak king or pocket pair.

Edit -- agree with jcm as well. Going for a check-raise on the turn here is pretty bad -- I'd bet out at least 2/3 of the pot. Your weak 2 pair is really vulnerable.

mlagoo · #6 06-17-2005, 04:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Since you're so sure of yourself I'll tell you he had 6h7h.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're right -- that's one hand combination I failed to include. Regardless, there's 2850 in the pot, 1100 more to call, and I'm willing to take the odds he doesn't have one of the very few hands that is beating me here.

david050173 · #7 06-17-2005, 04:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Since you're so sure of yourself I'll tell you he had 6h7h.

[/ QUOTE ]

A3 of hearts. Not good enought to raise preflop but good enough to call. More outs than god on the flop. Makes a weak bet to build a pot on the turn when he has the 2nd nuts. Just calls because he wants you to bluff at the river. On the river he figures there is no way you called with 67 but you have a good enough hand to call a big bet.

I don't mind the check-raise (I am not sure if you will get bet at enough to make it worthwhile) but you have to put in a real raise (500) when he makes that weak bet. You have decided that 2 pair is a good enough hand to play in this situation. With a 2 flush draws, a straight, and one large over you don't really want to see the river. There are 4 cards that help you. You don't want to see a heart, a club, a 2 or king. Thats a lot of cards.

future · #8 06-17-2005, 04:36 PM

Let's assume you bet t400 on the turn and get called. What's your play on the river?

RobGW · #9 06-17-2005, 05:04 PM

Hero has shown strength on every street. Villian raises all in on the river in the face of this aggression. Does villian really think he can bluff hero out? Villian also has plenty of chips left if he folds so risking his tourney with a bluff would be ludicris. Like I said before, 2 pair is not a monster. I know 2 pair usually will win but when everything points otherwise, ignore that info at your own risk.

mlagoo · #10 06-17-2005, 05:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Hero has shown strength on every street. Villian raises all in on the river in the face of this aggression. Does villian really think he can bluff hero out? Villian also has plenty of chips left if he folds so risking his tourney with a bluff would be ludicris. Like I said before, 2 pair is not a monster. I know 2 pair usually will win but when everything points otherwise, ignore that info at your own risk.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol

i was just thinking it'd be really good if you came into every thread i'm in and said "two pair is not a monster!"

i get it dude. i play g00t. i'm sure you do ok. i'm more loose aggressive than you. i'm comfortable with that. if you like how you play, why don't we just let this one drop, mmk?