Waiting to look at your hole cards until the action is to you

[CrackerZack]

I went through a phase of this at my home game, but that's just fooling around more than anything. Its really dumb either way though.

[jedi]

Part of this depends on the players you're up against. If they're clueless, then who cares?

That having been said, my friend and I debated this as he's going to the WSOP main event. My comment is the same as most people here, don't look until the action gets to you. However, he would rather look when he gets his cards first, when everyone else is concentrating on the player UTG or looking at their own cards. Then, he lifts his head up and observes the other players when they do look at their own cards. Just food for thought.

[John Deere]

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how could anyone like the idea of playing your blind truly blind unless someone has raised? does that mean you check your option all the time without looking? if so you're giving up EV.

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Last week, I sat to the left of a guy who checked his big blind without looking. He also informed me that he _always_ chops -- even with pocket aces (because he once lost with them heads up in the SB against the BB). Nice guy, though.

[tpir90036]

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He also informed me that he _always_ chops -- even with pocket aces

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the point of chopping is to speed the game up and not fight over a nothing pot that is going to get raked down to sh*t. if you only chop with bad hands and want to play when you get aces then you don't get it....

[GuyOnTilt]

Hey Moyer,

I think the value of not emitting tells by looking at your cards early (and noticing them from players on your left that do look early) comes more from seeing whether they're going to muck, limp, or raise than getting a read on what kind of specific hand you think they have. I have been able to play my hand much better preflop because of looking to my left, as well as postflop occassionally. Raising from 2 off the Button becomes a more profitable play when the two players to your left have their cards between their finger an inch above the felt. In essence, you already know you have the Button, while the playes in the blinds perceive your raise to be from late MP. There's many other applicable scenarios, but this is the one that I myself most often in.

GoT

[daryn]

i always chop too, yes even with aces. since i don't look at my cards until the action gets to me, whenever i'm in a position to chop, i just chop and then flip the cards up to see what i had (for no reason really).

like another poster said, the point of chopping really is to not let the house take a drop off the hand when you're heads up.

anyways, always checking your option out of the big blind without looking is still dumb.

[JGalt]

Two points

1st - If you look at your cards right away, you may give off a tell at that point and gives more time to give off a tell. It can also give you time to re-evaluate your hand. Well I'll fold this, but if those three call then I'll give it a shot, damn only two called, I'll try anyways. Can work much to your disadvantage IMHO.

2nd - I think in the higher limits, especially NL and tourneys in order to be more unpredictable they will hesitate and mull over a hand even though they know they're gonna fold. It can be very easy to get inot habits which become second nature and I think they try to minimize that as much as possible.

[gunboat]

I would like to take the contrary position and advocate that it is better not to wait until the action is on you before looking at your cards - at least in low and some intermediate limit games.

1) You don't want to draw attention to yourself. The observant players will immediately see that you know what you are doing (or at least think you do). Even the unobservant will soon notice that you are not playing many hands as the action pauses, even if only briefly, when it gets to you.

2) You do not want to be perceived as taking the game too seriously, as that will cause others to tighten up.

3) You may feel pressured to make a quick decision on marginal hands so as not to give the idea that you have something to think about.

For higher stakes, NL and especially tournaments the waiting is fine, even expected. Especially in tournaments, you do want the others to notice and respect you.

I have tried to learn to give my cards a quick glance after the second is dealt while keeping an eye to my left and peripheral attention to the others while they look at their cards. You don't have to actually see them looking at their cards. Their mannerisms afterwards are where the tells are.

Some which I notice.

Covering cards with both hands or pulling them closer - these are good cards and the player is not letting go of them.

Apparent disinterest in the action without getting the cards ready to muck - this is also a strong hand.

Asking where the action is, especially if it isn't to him yet. He can't wait to get his chips in, or to see the flop if they are already in. This is a very strong hand or a big drawing hand. Watch on the flop to see which.

The manner in which the chips go into the pot.

I have never gotten much from watching a player actually look at the hole cards. And I don't want the others to think I am watching them - which is all to obvious if you wait for the action to look.

[Ed Miller]

Is this a common thing to do?

I switched to this about a year ago, and I certainly don't regret it. I think that it is strictly better than looking immediately... I see no downside.

Interestingly, I look at my cards immediately when I play stud. I use the extra time to compare my hand to the upcards and stuff.

I also look immediately when I play Omaha. It takes me like ten seconds to figure out what the hell I have. People would want to beat me if I waited.

[luckycharms]

nice post and good reasoning, gunboat

Personally, I try to watch the action and peek my cards when the action gets to a rock. Best of both worlds, huh? Plus I raaaaarely pick up tells when people peek the hole cards.