This wasn't in the plan : KK Hand

Hybrid_11 · #1 11-04-2005, 03:41 PM

BB likes to lead the pot hes a loose player so his bet doesnt mean much to me and i dont have any reads on UTG. The plan was to raise the turn as long as an ace didnt come but UTG beat me to the punch, whats my action?

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, Hero raises, 5 folds, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (8.50 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, Hero calls.

Turn: (5.75 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB Bets, UTG Raises, Hero .....?
Final Pot: 5.75 BB

toss · #2 11-04-2005, 03:43 PM

Come on just raise the flop you're not going to get more value by waiting for the turn now you're in a crappy spot.

TheHip41 · #3 11-04-2005, 03:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
BB likes to lead the pot hes a loose player so his bet doesnt mean much to me and i dont have any reads on UTG. The plan was to raise the turn as long as an ace didnt come but UTG beat me to the punch, whats my action?

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, Hero raises, 5 folds, BB calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (8.50 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
BB bets, UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, Hero calls.

Turn: (5.75 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
BB Bets, UTG Raises, Hero .....?
Final Pot: 5.75 BB

[/ QUOTE ]

You called the flop so you could raise the turn, so, raise the turn. If you don't feel comfortable doing that, then just raise the flop.

Seriously though, all three of your options suck. Folding is weak, Cold-calling 2 is not good, and 3-betting is spewing.

This is what happens when you just call the flop.

Hybrid_11 · #4 11-04-2005, 03:50 PM

yeah thats the prediciment i got myself into all 3 options kind of suck its which one suckes the least. Not usually trick player but it seemed like this could be the time on a pretty uncoordinated board

toss · #5 11-04-2005, 03:53 PM

Maybe HU its better to wait for the turn to raise, but theres another guy in the pot and I want value from him now. Lots of people at 2/4 like to peel flops with crap and fold turns.

Nick C · #6 11-04-2005, 03:54 PM

I would probably just raise the flop, though there are potential advantages to waiting. (Also, part of the reason I like to wait occasionally is that I don't want my opponents thinking if I raise preflop but then just call the flop that always means I have overcards, if they're paying attention. However, enough slowplaying goes on at the table in general that I'd imagine most people are on the lookout for it, at least a little.)

As for the turn, well, that sucks. On the flop, was UTG slowplaying his 77? Was he unsure about his JT? Did he have a gutshot with 98? Or was he just waiting until the turn, like you were, with his AJ? I don't know.

But I think there's enough of a chance that you're ahead or at least have 8 outs (the kings, 7's, and 2's) that I'd probably cold-call [img]/images/graemlins/blush.gif[/img].

toss · #7 11-04-2005, 03:59 PM

I'd probably 3-bet the turn and check behind on the river. I hate folding, I hate coldcalling then calling one more on the river. Here we may be able to freeze the action if theres a better hand than ours and we extract value when we're ahead.

ErrantNight · #8 11-04-2005, 04:10 PM

your plan to not raise the flop sucks.

W. Deranged · #9 11-04-2005, 04:18 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Come on just raise the flop you're not going to get more value by waiting for the turn now you're in a crappy spot.

[/ QUOTE ]

I just wanted to say that this post clearly proves the great expressive value of the run-on sentence.

And, Toss is right... hero should raise the flop.