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#42
10-25-2005, 06:50 PM
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Re: Bush appoints Bernake Chairmen of the Federal Reserve
</font><blockquote><font class="small">En respuesta a:</font><hr />
The fixed income analysts I've talked to think he is a solid choice. Markets are ok wiht him too. [/ QUOTE ] Markets like him, wide acceptance by most economists, very solid background in monetary policy..all in all a pretty good choice 
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#43
10-25-2005, 10:05 PM
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Re: Bush appoints Bernake Chairmen of the Federal Reserve
[ QUOTE ]
Please give me some historical examples from the capitalist era where the conditions you describe produced a standard currency (not sanctioned and upheld by government) that served effectively as the medium of exchange for a national economy. [/ QUOTE ] 13th-Century northern Italy is full of examples. Some city-states (Genoa, e.g.) even had so little intervention that multiple metals circulated simultaneously (bimetallism is often described as "unstable" but that's only the case when government tries to enforce a fixed ratio of value between different metals). [ QUOTE ] Then please explain to me how such a currency would be integrated into the contemporary financial system. [/ QUOTE ] I'm not sure how to answer the question. The "contemporary financial system" would adapt. That much is certain. I'm not particularly interested in predicting the particulars.
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#44
10-26-2005, 12:17 AM
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Re: Bush appoints Bernake Chairmen of the Federal Reserve
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] The fed not only contributes to inflation, but also contributes to deflation so it balances out, but it is true the target rate is something like a 3% inflation, however this changes over time. [/ QUOTE ] If the target rate is not 0, it doesn't "balance out." [/ QUOTE ] I'm going to amend this even a bit further. Even if the net effect DID cancel out *in the aggregate* to zero, the policy would still be unjustifiable. Deflation doesn't simply "roll back" damages done by inflation - the end state is not the same as the beginning state. Is it OK to shoot one man in the head and then father a child, since the net effect on population is "balanced out"?
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#45
10-26-2005, 11:34 AM
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Re: Bush appoints Bernake Chairmen of the Federal Reserve
[ QUOTE ]
13th-Century northern Italy is full of examples. Some city-states (Genoa, e.g.) even had so little intervention that multiple metals circulated simultaneously (bimetallism is often described as "unstable" but that's only the case when government tries to enforce a fixed ratio of value between different metals). [/ QUOTE ] So the only examples you can muster predate the rise of both "real" capitalist economies and nation states? That is what I imagined. [ QUOTE ] The "contemporary financial system" would adapt. That much is certain. [/ QUOTE ] Yes, it would adapt. By collapsing.
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#46
10-26-2005, 11:37 AM
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Re: Bush appoints Bernake Chairmen of the Federal Reserve
finally someone who is on my side, I just didn't want to argue with him anymore, his mind is pretty set on being 100% free-market no government involvement at all.
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#47
10-26-2005, 01:20 PM
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Re: Bush appoints Bernake Chairmen of the Federal Reserve
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] 13th-Century northern Italy is full of examples. Some city-states (Genoa, e.g.) even had so little intervention that multiple metals circulated simultaneously (bimetallism is often described as "unstable" but that's only the case when government tries to enforce a fixed ratio of value between different metals). [/ QUOTE ] So the only examples you can muster predate the rise of both "real" capitalist economies and nation states? That is what I imagined. [/ QUOTE ] I'm not sure what your point is. Are you making an argument along the lines of "it's not the status quo, therefore it's unworkable"? Further, I'm confused by your use of the term "real" in describing modern capitalist economies, since what we have now (and have had) are government-influenced economies, not true capitalist economies. Are you arguing that a true free market in money is incompatible with an elaborate system of nation-states? If so, I have no problem with that, since I advocate the dissolution of nation-states.
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#48
10-26-2005, 01:42 PM
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Re: Bush appoints Bernake Chairmen of the Federal Reserve
[ QUOTE ]
I'm not sure what your point is. Are you making an argument along the lines of "it's not the status quo, therefore it's unworkable"? [/ QUOTE ] No. My argument is that there is no historical evidence that what you are proposing is viable for advanced capitalist economies. It only exists in abstract dreams and rought models scratched on paper. [ QUOTE ] Further, I'm confused by your use of the term "real" in describing modern capitalist economies, since what we have now (and have had) are government-influenced economies, not true capitalist economies. [/ QUOTE ] None of the pertinent major thinkers defined capitalism as a system of economic organization lacking government intervention. When I speak of "real" capitalism, I refer to the more or less complete commodification of land, labor, and capital that occurred with the full breakdown of the feudal order (not until fairly late in some european countries). [ QUOTE ] Are you arguing that a true free market in money is incompatible with an elaborate system of nation-states? If so, I have no problem with that, since I advocate the dissolution of nation-states. [/ QUOTE ] It is incompatible with the nation state, as well as with the viability of market economies on larger than a local level. If you want to advocate the dissolution of nation-states, that is your prerogative. If you think there is any chance of it happening in the advanced parts of the world, then you are deeply misguided. Why not move to Somalia or certain parts of Central Asia and experience these things first hand?
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#49
10-26-2005, 02:40 PM
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Re: Bush appoints Bernake Chairmen of the Federal Reserve
[ QUOTE ]
My argument is that there is no historical evidence that what you are proposing is viable for advanced capitalist economies. It only exists in abstract dreams and rought models scratched on paper. [/ QUOTE ] In other words, "don't try anything new." If that's your only objection, it's incredibly weak. [ QUOTE ] None of the pertinent major thinkers defined capitalism as a system of economic organization lacking government intervention. [/ QUOTE ] So what? By itself, this is effectively a continuation of the "don't try anything new" argument. [ QUOTE ] When I speak of "real" capitalism, I refer to the more or less complete commodification of land, labor, and capital that occurred with the full breakdown of the feudal order (not until fairly late in some european countries). [/ QUOTE ] Or still continuing, depending on how you look at it. "Full commodification" cannot occur as long as governments continue to interfere in markets. Your "real" capitalism has not yet been achieved. [ QUOTE ] Why not move to Somalia or certain parts of Central Asia and experience these things first hand? [/ QUOTE ] The "go move to Somalia" argument is bogus, and I've shown why it is about 400x in this forum.
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#50
10-26-2005, 03:48 PM
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Re: Bush appoints Bernake Chairmen of the Federal Reserve
[ QUOTE ]
finally someone who is on my side, I just didn't want to argue with him anymore [/ QUOTE ] If you had an actual argument, nobody here knew what it was. Personally, I'm still waiting for your tally.
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Linear Mode
