Stud8 - Day 5, Hand 9

[Aaron W.]

I very much appreciate all the comments that I've been receiving. I've got three more hands from that session.

The limper on 3rd street was pretty bad. I've seen him show down hands where he limped a Q with two lows. So I raised to isolate him. The hold'em player in me likes being assertive and betting/raising a bunch, but if it's not very smart, then I'll have to learn to adjust.

7 Card Stud High-Low ($0.25/$0.50), Ante $0.05, Bring-In $0.10 (converter)

3rd Street - (1.60 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___brings-in___folds
Seat 2: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 3: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Hero: 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 5: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 6: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 7: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 8: xx xx 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds

4th Street - (5.00 SB)

Seat 3: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___raises
Hero: 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets___calls
Seat 5: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls___folds

5th Street - (5.00 BB)

Seat 3: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___checks___calls

6th Street - (7.00 BB)

Seat 3: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks___folds

Total pot: (7.00 BB)

[Alchemist]

Looks fine. In this hand, you got the added benefit of realizing how strong Seat 3's hand was. 6th street is quite clearly a fold.

[Spladle Master]

I don't like it. I'd limp third, re-raise fourth, call sixth.

[Alchemist]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like it. I'd limp third, re-raise fourth, call sixth.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'd limp 3rd myself but since the OP completed, let's go from there.

He's shown strength with his Ace in the door. An important consideration is: do we think our opponents think we're raising a pair of Aces only and not a good low? Seat 3 doesn't seem to care. On 4th Street he caught a suited baby and raised Hero who completed third who's now showing A2. I can't see any benefit to reraising here as 1) we're not going to get him to fold and 2) there's a good chance we're behind in both directions.

6th street: OK, so OP said Villain could have anything in the hole. But what does Hero have? Ace high and no low. Villain caught a 3rd wheel card while hero bricked again. Just because Seat 3 might be a terrible player doesn't mean he doesn't have a hand. Hero needs something if goes to a showdown and if he does, I think he'll be lucky to win half.

I ran a couple 6th street sims:

Hero vs. Villain with 2 random hole cards:

====================
Calculation results from Poker Calculator 1.1.4.1
7 Card Stud hi/lo 8/b, 209440 combinations tested.

Dead cards: 3h, 5s, 6s, 8s, 9d, Jc, Qd

Hand | Ts5c4s2cxx | AsKcTh7h3s2h |
------+--------------+--------------+
High | 43989 | 29164 |
Draw | 621 | 621 |
Lose | 53759 | 82456 |
Scoop | 82456 | 53759 |
Low | 29164 | 43494 |
------+--------------+--------------+
Win% | 56.91% | 43.09% |
------+--------------+--------------+


Ts5c4s2cxx:
High Card win: 1431 draw: 54 lose: 53555
Pair win: 69878 draw: 18 lose: 29368
Two Pair win: 33344 draw: 0 lose: 0
Three of a Kind win: 5248 draw: 0 lose: 0
Straight win: 11936 draw: 0 lose: 0
Flush win: 3264 draw: 0 lose: 0
Full House win: 1248 draw: 0 lose: 0
Quads win: 32 draw: 0 lose: 0
Straight Flush win: 64 draw: 0 lose: 0


AsKcTh7h3s2h:
High Card win: 29839 draw: 54 lose: 89787
Pair win: 53084 draw: 18 lose: 36658
===========================

Hero gets scooped about 40% of the time against random hole cards and may already be drawing completely dead.

Make one of Villain's hole cards the A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]:
Hero: .367
Villain: .633

Make one of Villain's hole cards the 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]:
Hero: .346
Villain: .654

I instamuck 6th, think to myself how much I hate stud, and move on to the next hand.

[imported_getfunky]

[ QUOTE ]
Quote1:
I don't like it. I'd limp third, re-raise fourth, call sixth.
Quote2:
I'd limp 3rd myself but since the OP completed, let's go from there.

[/ QUOTE ] Why limp? I always like to raise with my ace low draws since it confuses opponents when I play aces the same way and sets up bluffs when we both brick. Why do you guys prefer limping? I rarely limp with aa3, but if I limped with ace lows I would probably have to begin to limp with this hand as well.

[Aaron W.]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like it. I'd limp third, re-raise fourth, call sixth.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can see reasons for limping on third, but which one would you emphasize as the "main" reason?

- The 5 limped in front of you
- You are in early position
- There are some lows behind me who might be drawing worse and you want them in the pot
- This hand doesn't have enough value to raise, and the deception value of raising the open ace isn't enough to offset this fact

[Andy B]

I think limping is better on third, but raising is fine too. I would call sixth. There are a few bets out there, and you should be able to escape often enough to make it worthwhile.

[Chris Daddy Cool]

i personally wouldn't raise 3rd, but raising is okay.

i'm interested to know peoples feelings about 6th. i think its very likely that the villian doesn't have a pair at all and just has a low, or has a pair but does not yet have a low.

[imported_getfunky]

i guess i don't like announcing my hand, and i do think think a live ace plays much better against fewer opponents .. nevertheless, if the table shows a big tendency to call bricks, it is a good strategy to limp more often with low hands as you will encourage a mistake(poorer pots odds when chasing) and your 4th st. folds will gain equity as well