"Fold, keep your image tight so you can steal more later"

[poindexter]

Your a moron so I will make this my last post.

"if poker prophecy says so" "i must have missed when they become known for anything other than their glaring inaccuracies."

This is the exact comment I would expect from a player like you. It usually is accompanied by a 20-37 ITM percentage. Care to prove me wrong by giving me your party handle?

“Plus I cash out about once every two weeks, so I don't anticipate my roll getting there anytime soon”

this statement is better translated as: I get a beat down every time I move up so I stay down here where I am comfortable.

Now its time to go support my family playing sng's the wrong way.

[curtains]

[ QUOTE ]
Your a moron so I will make this my last post.

"if poker prophecy says so" "i must have missed when they become known for anything other than their glaring inaccuracies."

This is the exact comment I would expect from a player like you. It usually is accompanied by a 20-37 ITM percentage. Care to prove me wrong by giving me your party handle?

“Plus I cash out about once every two weeks, so I don't anticipate my roll getting there anytime soon”

this statement is better translated as: I get a beat down every time I move up so I stay down here where I am comfortable.

Now its time to go support my family playing sng's the wrong way.

[/ QUOTE ]


Yeah god forbid this poster have a measly 37% ITM percentage.

[Degen]

[ QUOTE ]
d) passing up +EV spots is bad.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've heard you say this before and really don't quite understand what you mean...

Could you provide a couple of "+EV" spots that you think the 'play tight so you can steal' mentality has people passing on?

[citanul]

the classic one that i'm talking about and have referenced in this thread several times is blind steals in the mid/early levels.

say, 25/50 folded to you in lp with AJo, AJs or AQ or something like that. these hands may be a bit too good for the actual example, but whatever, people are saying "why would you raise here, why not just fold and preserve your image."

mostly people use it as a coverall for playing very weak tight. particularly this thread is meant to address preflop overtightness of a particular variety.

i've said that passing +EV spots is bad in the past and i will continue to say it in the future. in other times and places i have been talking about other types of spots such as the classic "i'm only a coinflip so i fold" mentality, though those people never say they are doing it for image reasons, instead pointing to not wanting to bust out of a tournament early.

citanul

[adanthar]

BTW, I realize not many people will agree with me and I understand if you choose not to do this, but if you have something like AJ in LP in level 3, you raise and everyone folds, there's nothing wrong with showing it.

[Degen]

[ QUOTE ]
the classic one that i'm talking about and have referenced in this thread several times is blind steals in the mid/early levels.

say, 25/50 folded to you in lp with AJo, AJs or AQ or something like that. these hands may be a bit too good for the actual example, but whatever, people are saying "why would you raise here, why not just fold and preserve your image."

mostly people use it as a coverall for playing very weak tight. particularly this thread is meant to address preflop overtightness of a particular variety.

i've said that passing +EV spots is bad in the past and i will continue to say it in the future. in other times and places i have been talking about other types of spots such as the classic "i'm only a coinflip so i fold" mentality, though those people never say they are doing it for image reasons, instead pointing to not wanting to bust out of a tournament early.

citanul

[/ QUOTE ]

ok thats all good w/ regard to blind steals...what about if the pot has been limped? maybe not at the 215's or even 109's...but at 55's and below people often limp all kinds of crap up front and having a hand like AQo in LP is (long term) a better hand than the average and therefore +EV...so would you advocate raising this?

If you'd like me to give the specific example:

Hero is button w/ average stack at level 2 of a 55 with 9 players. 4 people limp and Hero has a read on none of them.

Hero is deal A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]


I muck here, though I'm quite certain it is +EV to raise...what do ya'll masters think?

[citanul]

i'm dead sure that raising or limping is +ev when compared to folding in this spot.

folding in this spot reduces variance [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] but a good player should be able to play this hand profitably. i realize that this is counter to a lot of what gets taught/said around here, but whatever.

there is a (growing?) contingency of good players who are becoming vocal about the idea that if you are comfortable playing post flop, and do so well, playing more hands in good spots is preferable to playing fewer hands safely.

playing very safe has been advocated, even by very good respectable players saying to open fold JJ in ep in early levels, and is profitable, quite possibly at every stake currently offered at party, but is exploitable by the best players, and is not optimal, since it is less profitable than another strategy.

citanul

[adanthar]

I don't raise that hand without reads on the limpers (if there are enough regulars in the game they won't put chips in postflop unless they hit sets), but of course you have to at least limp.

I also limp 22, 75s and T7o there and there is absolutely no reason not to limp half the deck in that spot.

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]


Yeah god forbid this poster have a measly 37% ITM percentage.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well if prophecy says 37% then its really probably more like 33%.

[curtains]

I agree that folding is terrible there for 30 chips and AQo on the button in degens example. You have to trust that you have enough ability to play poker that you will be clearly +ev postflop with this hand.