$80-$160 Hand

Jim Brier · #1 11-17-2002, 05:37 AM

I was playing in a 9-handed $80-$160 game at the Bellagio and observed the following hand. Before telling you what happened, I will ask what you would do.

A tourists limps in under the gun and a middle player limps. A good player raises having the Td-Tc. Only the tourist and the other limper call. The flop is: As-Ah-8d. It is checked to the good player who bets. Only the tourist calls. The turn is the 2c. The tourists checks. What should the good player do?

I will post the results later.

J_V · #2 11-17-2002, 05:52 AM

These questions aren't instructive at all. Unless we have player knowledge or some background,both checking and betting can be justified. What makes a player great, is not his ability to analyze a generic situation as such, but to understand what your opponent is thinking in this situation. If you must have a default play, checking is best, or betting and folding to a raise.

PokerPrince · #3 11-17-2002, 06:13 AM

Bet.

PokerPrince

J_V · #4 11-17-2002, 06:22 AM

I just reread my post and it read to harsh. I didn't mean my mean to sound so condescending. However, I do think that player background is crucial for these type of questions. Understaning what the opponent is thinking in these situation separates the decent players from the great players. I'll be in Vegas the week before Thanksgiving, if I run into a Mr. Brier I'll say hi. Hopefully you won't have gotten all my chips yet.

Gabe · #5 11-17-2002, 06:43 AM

With out question, bet the turn. As to what to do on the river if called, that's another story.

Billy LTL · #6 11-17-2002, 07:31 AM

Bet the turn. What else can you do? If he calls and checks the river, bet again.

Sure there's a danger of the guy feeling overwhelmed and simply calling down with a bigger pair than you but you can't miss bets simply because of that possibility. Egad, he might even have an A - is the word "tourist" synonymous with "super live one" in Vegas?

To JV - Sure more player info would be nice but often times when at the table what Jim's given us is all we've got to go on anyway.

Best of luck. Billy (LTL)

skp · #7 11-17-2002, 08:12 AM

It's not a gimme decision. The flop is rainbow and offers no gutshots. The tourist either has a pocket pair or an Ace. It is said that in general, checking KK when an Ace flops is better than checking TT because with TT, there are overcards that can hit. But here, there is simply no way that the tourist called the flop with a 6 outer or even a 3 outer. He has a 2 outer or you do...simple. I would check unless I thought the guy was fishy enough to call with a pocket pair on the turn or if he was rash enough to raise often with a hand that is inferior to mine.

Billy LTL · #8 11-17-2002, 08:31 AM

Skp - Would the tourist limp from under the gun with JJ or higher? Maybe, but I doubt it. I think you're right about him holding a pocket pair, and my money would be gambling on the hope that my read was correct and his pair was in fact smaller than mine.

An ace? Sure he could have one though I feel much better about seeing two aces on board than just seeing one.

Trefo · #9 11-17-2002, 10:00 AM

I feel the tourist might have KQ or such since there was no preflop raising.....yet on the other hand if tourist is synonymous with bad player than he could hold a higher pocket than 10's and is a weak tight player who will call to the end and win with his better pocket pair or maybe could have paired the 8's. I don't play these limits but I doubt someone playing 80-160 has no idea how to play hold em.

budman · #10 11-17-2002, 10:45 AM

As a 'tourist' myself, I can tell you that if I held a mediocre Ace I would check call the good player all the way. I might even call him down with KK or QQ and possibly an 8, but probably nothing worse. With continued pressure I might give up any hand that did not contain an Ace.

Therefore, I would recommend betting the turn, folding to a raise. If called and checked to on the river, check. If bet into on the river, fold.