KK hand, too tricky?

Shymon · #1 07-23-2004, 03:00 AM

this was played at the 25 nl party game. my foe is a LAG from the few hands i have seen and my play was based entirely on this fact. comments on how i played every street are welcome.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (9 handed)

saw flop|saw showdown

MP2 ($26.65)
MP3 ($25)
CO ($14.75)
Button ($180.90)
Hero ($24)
BB ($44.10)
UTG ($65.30)
UTG+1 ($11.55)
MP1 ($18.50)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. MP3 posts a blind of $0.50.
3 folds, MP2 calls $0, MP3 (poster) checks, CO calls $0, 1 fold, Hero raises to $4, 1 fold,50,50, MP2 calls $3.50, MP3 folds, CO folds.

Flop: ($9.50) 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP2 checks.

Turn: ($9.50) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP2 bets $1, Hero calls $1.

River: ($11.50) K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $10, MP2 calls $10.

Final Pot: $31.50

umdpoker · #2 07-23-2004, 03:15 AM

i don't like it. i can't even express in words why i don't like it. i will think about this and get back to you. there is just something about waiting till an obvious scare card hits to bet that bothers me.

Shymon · #3 07-23-2004, 03:17 AM

bothers me too, my plan was to try and have him catch enough to hang himself on the turn. but he bet far less then i expected, i don't know, it seemed like a good idea at the time.

potato · #4 07-23-2004, 03:27 AM

You waited for a card that will completely kill the action to bet?

umdpoker · #5 07-23-2004, 04:02 AM

i don't really think the check on the flop was too bad. if he is lag he will bet most of the time. i think you should have raised him a little on the flop, like $4 or something to get some action going. he probably won't fold for such a small raise, and it will make it easier to stack him later.

Wayfare · #6 07-23-2004, 09:36 AM

If he was a thinking yet agro player (or just LAG as you describe) I probably would have bet the flop like $2 in order to try to get him to raise me. That often works with party idiots -- they raise you big because they think your bet is weak (from other people, it usually is). Also, he isn't folding anything he paid $4 preflop for $2 more. When the ace comes I check and hope he bets (he is LAG and you are showing incredible weakness). When the king falls I either sell it like you did or simply go all in, depending on the remaining stacks.

At least you got paid off in the end, dispite it being sort of circular.

pdubz · #7 07-23-2004, 09:52 AM

I suppose it just depends on what type of LAG player you make him for. Even LAG's have different styles of play, so you just need to figure out how to get all your money in.

If you know he will bluff at pots and also does not respect check-raises, I think its OK to check to him every street, and raise him enough to hope for a push. But I think its pretty rare a LAG that will think a check-raise as unsignificant/always a bluff.

I know some LAG's like to call down every street and then bluff really big on the river if they think their opponent has been betting down too softly, and in these situations I'll bet 1/2 pot on each street. In general if I flop a monster against a LAG who I haven't figured out yet, I will bet normally, and just wait for him to come over the top of me.

bingledork · #8 07-23-2004, 10:12 AM

If I was your opponent, I'd be thankful you bet so little.
Checking the flop is OK, but what's with calling $1 on the turn?

Kirkrrr · #9 07-23-2004, 10:27 AM

I would've bet some marginal amount on the flop and, him being LAG, he probably would've tested you and raised or at least called (with 9.50 in the pot, I seriously doubt he would've folded for any bet less than at least half-pot). When that Ace fell, checked, and tried to sell it on the river for half-pot... if he doesn't have the Ace (and he obviously didn't have any K's [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]), there's nothing else he can have that he could call a reasonable bet with. A less than pot-sized bet at least gives him a chance to try and bluff at it.

Kirk R.

Wayfare · #10 07-23-2004, 10:40 AM

Kirkr and I are in full agreement on most posts.

Glad to hear I'm not alone out here [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]