Violating a Cardinal Rule (Stud High)

[Jeffage]

I decided to play this unconventionally in this shorthanded game (not folding 4th, checking 5th). Possibly not interesting. Comments?


7 Card Stud High ($30/$60), Ante $5, Bring-In $10 (converter)

3rd Street - (0.50 SB)

Seat 2: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___brings-in___calls
Seat 4: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___folds
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___raises

4th Street - (2.50 SB)

Seat 2: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls

5th Street - (3.25 BB)

Seat 2: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks

6th Street - (3.25 BB)

Seat 2: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___bets

River - (5.25 BB)

Seat 2: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] xx___calls
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___bets

Total pot: (7.25 BB)

Results in White...Reply First Please

<font color="white">Results:
Total pot $435 | Rake $1

Seat 2: [8d 6s 7d 7c 8s Ac 3s]

Hero: [Kc Qd Qh Jd Qs 5s 5c] (a full house, Queens full of Fives)

</font>

[vintage_sara]

Jeff,

I really enjoy your short 30-60 hands. Give me a little more information about the player. Have you played with him or her much? How were you playing during that particular session and how was your opponent playing?

[Jeffage]

The player was unknown to me and the game was playing fast and aggro. Of course, now Carlos has shown up and the game filled up instantly. [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

Jeff

[CarlosChadha]

I think the call on 4th is fine 3 handed...the BI will tend to RR w/ pairs more often than in a full game, so there is a good chance to are ahead.

Checking 5th is interesting...I am asuming you are going for a check raise immediately, rather then getting really sneaky and just calling. I think I'd just bet out though because all you are really doing is giving him a free shot at a full house if he has 2 pair or 3 7s. Plus, he might even raise you with 3 7s or wired As if he is particularly frisky. You are also allowing him the chance to pick up a runner-runner draw on 6th (like if he started with a 3 flush). Basically it is way to tempting for him to take a free card with anything else but trips (and you don't nessecarily make more money if he has trips), and there are a lot of cards that could come on 6th that give him enough equity in the pot to call one more be tto see the river.

-Carlos

[lstream]

I am OK with the call on fourth. I don't like the check on fifth. Not sure about this logic, but here goes:

1. He likely puts you on a steal when he calls you on third.

2. Then you call him with the open sevens - now he thinks, i guess this is not a steal. What's he calling with?

3. Then you pair your door on fifth and you check. If i was villain, this would look way too odd and I would be real suspicious. Remember, on the previous street I put you on some kind of a hand.

4. Given the above line, I would only call sixth if I had the trip sevens or maybe pocket aces or kings. Otherwise, I fold.

So you have given him a free shot to outdraw your queens, but only if he has a pretty good shot at overtaking your queens.

OK - off to read the white text to see how wrong I am.

[vintage_sara]

In a short-handed game I don't think the call is bad necessarily on 4th street as it most likely is in a ring game. My call would likely depend on the player and the fact that I am also building a semi-straight albeit with a 10 out on 3rd street.

At times I might even raise here depending on the player as he is likely to stay high now with the open pair and if I hit an open pair I will have either three queens as you got, kings and queens or queens and jacks...hands that all potentially fill to beat 7s full or any other smaller full that the might he drawing to. I also have the option to possibly check fifth and see 6th for free.

I would more often bet out on 5th street here rather manuveur for the check-raise, which I assume you are doing. The reason being is that you might actually get raised on 5th if he actually has the three sevens, which will give you the opportunity to three bet it.

If he has two pair, like most average players, he will continue to call you all the way down trying to fill in a way that he might get beat if you complete your hand as well.

I think the call on 4th is fine but I like a bet out on fifth street better than trying for a check-raise. Nice hand either way.

[Andy B]

I call on fourth. Presumably, the other guy could have a lot of things, and you have some secondary possibilities.

The check on fifth is interesting. It should look really suspicious, but in this case, it appears to have gained you two more calls, so it's hard to argue with it.

[Jeffage]

[ QUOTE ]
The check on fifth is interesting. It should look really suspicious, but in this case, it appears to have gained you two more calls, so it's hard to argue with it.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is what I'm after here. My opponent doesn't have to have trip sevens. In fact, he doesn't even have to have two pair here. I was just giving him a little rope, not planning on checkraising.

Jeff

[CarlosChadha]

The only type of rope you want to give him is giving him a free shot to make As or Ks up. I don't think that this made him 2 more bets...if his opponent was going to call down with 2 pair on 6th &amp; 7th, he would have called on 5th, so Jeffage just cost himself a big bet.

-Carlos

[Jeffage]

My opponent is not good. But if he only has sevens, he will fold them. I think this is much more likely than him having trips. So I give him a card to catchup or maybe make him think I only have queens so he gives himself an excuse to draw out. Also, it is possible that he could fold two pair to a 5th street bet since I've clearly rep'd at least one pair before that. But when I check 5th, he may think that his two pair is poss good and call all the way. I don't know, I like checking here but I could see it both ways.

Jeff