Ethics of a hidden cam in an non-sanctioned game

[Mackie]

I have to echo what others have said - secretly audio or video taping in an underground club is risking your life. Don't even think about it.

[Laomedon]

Definitely a terrible idea not just in the fact that you could get your ass kicked but also because I can't imagine it would really be worth the risk/time to record whatever low-limit action you're trying to commit to memory.

[Guruman]

I live in Texas too. People that play in underground rooms here tend to legally carry concealed weapons. Don't tape them.

[EWillers]

The thrust of my question is entirely theoretical (mayhaps I should have posted in the "poker theory" forum).

It is an issue of what is "ethical" at the table. Is maintaing a device that electronically records the action ethical? Does disclosure of the device make it ethical? If the device is just a simple paper and pencil, does that change its status?

I have no intention of doing any of these things. A friend asked me about what I thought of the idea (in theory) and I found it to be a thought provoking question (espically in light of programs like poker tracker).

[VoraciousReader]

It is an issue of what is "ethical" at the table. Is maintaing a device that electronically records the action ethical? Does disclosure of the device make it ethical? If the device is just a simple paper and pencil, does that change its status?

I have no intention of doing any of these things. A friend asked me about what I thought of the idea (in theory) and I found it to be a thought provoking question (espically in light of programs like poker tracker).

It is unethical, and it is completely different than PokerTracker.

Online, people have control over the exact amount of information that they give you. Pokertracker records their PLAY. Video cameras record their PERSON.

Recording an unknowing person via any media where they would be recognizable is completely unethical and unacceptable. Videotaping me , Amanda, is completely different from recording the play of me, JayhawkFan88 at playgootpoker.com. If you get permission, obviously, you are fine. If you are only taking notes with pen and paper, you don't, imo, even need permission--unless you take that person's picture and put it next to your notes. (Although if we were dealing with the real world, one might wish to get permission, to avoid running afoul of the concealed weapons mentioned earlier.)

Especially since we are talking about an environment where every user understands (or should) that there will be electronic records kept of every hand dealt to every player at all times, I don't think PokerTracker is problematic from an ethical standpoint.

Some of the other software programs are qualitatively different from PT and are, imo, a little more ethically questionable, but I don't wish to start a debate on those here.

[blendedsuit]

In many states, it is illegal to record audio of a person without their knowledge and consent.

[captswifty]

[ QUOTE ]
I live in Texas too. People that play in underground rooms here tend to legally carry concealed weapons. Don't tape them.

[/ QUOTE ]

Best reason to not tape them.

[InkyWretch]

[ QUOTE ]
I live in Texas and the powers that be ensure that the long arm of the law shall not authorise any cash games. That being the case, all games are underground.

If one could mount a hidden video camera to oneself (or even simply audio) to record the action in a session-for the purpose of putting to memory all the action at that session (a la pokertracker)-would such an action be unethical?

Does the question hinge on disclosure or is that irrelevant?

I'm not concerned with whether such an action would be advisable re: getting caught or any technical issues. Just simply is it in accordance with proper play of the game? Or would it be akin to cheating?

[/ QUOTE ]

Home cash games are legal in Texas. It only becomes illegal if there's a rake or sitting fee.

So you could have a table of people playing and it would be perfectly legal. But if you, as host, draw a rake out of the pot it's illegal.

[Al_Capone_Junior]

Well, when the cops find your bloody beaten body in the dumpster out back, maybe you can ask them. Or maybe you'll finally realize how unethical and repulsive this idea is after you get the living **** kicked out of you, which would be exactly what you deserve if you do this.

al