In a gun-free/defense free society this is all that would happen...

etgryphon · #1 10-03-2005, 11:55 AM

Men Charged In Fatal Pontiac Carjacking Return In Court
Man Shot While Calling 911

Two men charged with the murder of a man at a Pontiac gas station returned to court on Tuesday.

Christopher Eugene Jackson, 18, was scheduled to appear at Pontiac District Court at 1 p.m. for a preliminary hearing. The preliminary hearing for his alleged accomplice, 19-year-old Cordero Landrum, was scheduled for 9 a.m., according to Local 4 reports.

Both men have been charged with murder, carjacking and felony possession of a firearm in connection with the shooting death of 38-year-old David Lee Bingham.

Police said Bingham stopped for gas at a Sunoco station on July 5, while on his way to work, when he was carjacked by two men.

The men appeared to flee the scene in Bingham's truck, but police said Jackson followed Bingham into the station and fired four shots into his chest as he called 911.

"The attendant handed him the phone and dialed 911," said Sgt. William Ware of the Pontiac police. "And as he was on the phone talking to the attendant one of the assailants came in and began shooting."

Bingham was taken to Royal Oak Beaumont Hospital, where he was pronounced dead.

9-1-1 won't help you...It might even get you killed. That is the only defense that people have if the gun control crowd got its way.

-Gryph

Matty · #2 10-03-2005, 12:12 PM

Uh... those people were killed with guns.

Fact: Homicides (usually crimes of passion) happen more often in homes that contain a gun.

twowords · #3 10-03-2005, 12:12 PM

That was quite a sleight of hand. First you say we have achieved a gun-free society, then someone comes up with a gun!

Also I was wondering, do you typically bring a gun to work?

etgryphon · #4 10-03-2005, 12:37 PM

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That was quite a sleight of hand. First you say we have achieved a gun-free society, then a criminal comes up with a gun!

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FYP

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Also I was wondering, do you typically bring a gun to work?

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Yes, I do. Can't take it into the building because I work for the Feds so it stays in the car.

-Gryph

etgryphon · #5 10-03-2005, 12:42 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Uh... those people were killed with guns.

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Career criminals with guns. They aren't supposed to have them. How is taking gun away from law abiding people keep guns away from criminals?

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Fact: Homicides (usually crimes of passion) happen more often in homes that contain a gun.

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Fact, huh? Well here is the truth.

-Gryph

Matty · #6 10-03-2005, 01:00 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_con...estic_violence

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found that the risk of a homicide was in fact higher in homes where a gun was present; his study led to the conclusion that the risk of a crime of passion or other domestic dispute ending in homicide when a gun was available was large enough to overwhelm any protective effect the presence of a gun might have against burglaries, home invasions, etc.

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bobman0330 · #7 10-03-2005, 01:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Fact: Homicides (usually crimes of passion) happen more often in homes that contain a gun.

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Repeat after me: "Post hoc.."

Matty · #8 10-03-2005, 01:38 PM

Other variables were accounted for.

And "correlation is not causation" is a more accurate way to express the concept you're thinking of.

Aren't you the fake patriot from the Iraq thread?

MMMMMM · #9 10-03-2005, 01:56 PM

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found that the risk of a homicide was in fact higher in homes where a gun was present; his study led to the conclusion that the risk of a crime of passion or other domestic dispute ending in homicide when a gun was available was large enough to overwhelm any protective effect the presence of a gun might have against burglaries, home invasions, etc.

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So....THIMK, as the sign says...

Might not guns be more likely to be found in homes where the risk of homicide was ALREADY greater: such as in bad neighborhoods, or where someone feels threatened by their ex, so they go out and buy a gun? Additionally, an extra high percentage of violent criminals probably "own" guns. Is not the risk of homicide already greater in the homes of violent criminals, even without guns being present?

Correlation does not always equal causation. The cited paragraph does nothing to allay fears regarding the possible mistaking of correlation for causation in such matters.

etgryphon · #10 10-03-2005, 02:03 PM

you should add the rest (relevant parts) of passage to be fair

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More thoughtful critics of the work and its connection with calls for gun control point out that Kellermann's work does not address the overall question of the total risk or benefit of firearm ownership because it does not address any events occurring outside the house; and due to this limitation, assert that his result is really more of an indictment of domestic violence than of gun ownership. Even Kellermann himself includes in his paper several paragraphs referring to the need for further study of domestic violence and its causes and prevention. They argue that the vast majority of households which possess a gun are not at any risk for any form of domestic violence, making any increased risk from gun ownership related to this behavior totally irrelevant to most gunowners; and that restriction of the rights of the great majority for the protection of a few who might harm themselves is in keeping with neither the general tenor of United States law, nor the Second Amendment...

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Emphasis mine...

Here is a good critique of Kellermann's numbers. I don't think Kellermann's view is broad enough of the total situation.

-Gryph