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  #11  
Old 07-25-2005, 02:59 PM
TonyBlair TonyBlair is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

[ QUOTE ]
Do good players often check raise turned flushes,seems to me it would let the opponent off a lil too easy. I think i check behind this and call river

[/ QUOTE ]


I think this means you don't think villain has the flush. If I'm told he hasn't got a flush, I'm betting the turn enough for a call. Hero is ahead on the flop unless villain ia a retard or playing it risky-tricky.
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  #12  
Old 07-25-2005, 03:05 PM
ML4L ML4L is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

Hey fsu,

I'd bet the turn and call a check-raise all-in. Here is why:

You are ahead almost all of the time here. We have the ace, queen, nine, and six of hearts accounted for. What flush is he supposed to have? KJ/KT/JT/T8/87/75 are the only reasonable flushes. Some of those hands don't look like min-raising hands preflop; others are going to be pushed some percentage of the time on the flop.

His most likely hand is AK, in my opinion. AQ is another possibility, in which case you're freerolling. I wouldn't let those hands off the hook by playing a small pot. The money just isn't deep enough to worry about getting check-raised, especially when you have a ton of outs against a set/flush and when a worse hand (AxKh) might check-raise. Also note that a lot of your potential outs aren't getting you paid by a worse hand on the river if you do hit them.

Bet $750 and call the rest if he check-raises. Hope it worked out.

Mike
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  #13  
Old 07-25-2005, 03:08 PM
lapoker17 lapoker17 is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

Actually, on further reflection, I think we may be beat here a significant numbr of times. He's not leading into us on the flop with a small flush draw. He's also not calling the reraise without something biggish - Meaning, I think that I'm putting him squarely on KT/KJ hearts - Or, I guess, nothing at all if he's really tough. Without a read I'm not calling much of a bet on the river w/out my boat.

But then again, I just read ML4L's post, and I may be an idiot. Who knows.
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  #14  
Old 07-25-2005, 03:23 PM
KaneKungFu123 KaneKungFu123 is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

betting might make him fold AK. [ QUOTE ]
Hey fsu,

I'd bet the turn and call a check-raise all-in. Here is why:

You are ahead almost all of the time here. We have the ace, queen, nine, and six of hearts accounted for. What flush is he supposed to have? KJ/KT/JT/T8/87/75 are the only reasonable flushes. Some of those hands don't look like min-raising hands preflop; others are going to be pushed some percentage of the time on the flop.

His most likely hand is AK, in my opinion. AQ is another possibility, in which case you're freerolling. I wouldn't let those hands off the hook by playing a small pot. The money just isn't deep enough to worry about getting check-raised, especially when you have a ton of outs against a set/flush and when a worse hand (AxKh) might check-raise. Also note that a lot of your potential outs aren't getting you paid by a worse hand on the river if you do hit them.

Bet $750 and call the rest if he check-raises. Hope it worked out.

Mike

[/ QUOTE ]
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  #15  
Old 07-25-2005, 03:27 PM
ML4L ML4L is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

[ QUOTE ]
betting might make him fold AK.

[/ QUOTE ]

Checking behind on the turn might let him block with AK for $300 on the river.

Mike
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  #16  
Old 07-25-2005, 03:34 PM
ML4L ML4L is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

[ QUOTE ]
betting might make him fold AK.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is certainly true, but it's a matter of maximizing your value. True, sometimes he will fold the turn if you bet, while had you checked, he will check-call that same bet on the river. But, I think that you still make more money on average by betting the turn. That gives you a chance to stack him. That also gives you a chance to get some more money in before the river kills your action. And, as I mentioned in the other post, it eliminates the luxury of being able to block the river and keep the pot small (it's a lot tougher to get away with betting $300 into a $2500 pot with $600 more behind than it would be to bet $300 into an $1100 pot and $1300 behind).

Mike
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  #17  
Old 07-25-2005, 03:41 PM
KaneKungFu123 KaneKungFu123 is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
betting might make him fold AK.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is certainly true, but it's a matter of maximizing your value. True, sometimes he will fold the turn if you bet, while had you checked, he will check-call that same bet on the river. But, I think that you still make more money on average by betting the turn. That gives you a chance to stack him. That also gives you a chance to get some more money in before the river kills your action. And, as I mentioned in the other post, it eliminates the luxury of being able to block the river and keep the pot small (it's a lot tougher to get away with betting $300 into a $2500 pot with $600 more behind than it would be to bet $300 into an $1100 pot and $1300 behind).

Mike

[/ QUOTE ]

good post. i agree with you.
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  #18  
Old 07-25-2005, 05:29 PM
GFunk911 GFunk911 is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

[ QUOTE ]
If he has bottom set, he's reraising you on the flop with that board.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not saying you're wrong, but could you explain this a little?
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  #19  
Old 07-25-2005, 05:42 PM
lapoker17 lapoker17 is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

Sure - If villain has 66 in this spot, he essentially has the nuts. He knows FSU doesn't have AA and he's nearly certain he doesn't have QQ as a lot of players would've re-raised him PF with position in that spot (I probably wouldn't have, but he thinks most players would). So, he's sitting on what he knows to be the best hand, yet any A, Q, J, T, K or heart can look ugly on the turn, so he has to try and get all the money in right here, when he knows he's good.

Make sense?
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  #20  
Old 07-25-2005, 05:51 PM
rwperu34 rwperu34 is offline
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Default Re: party 2k NL. a turn i\'m not sure i like.

What is the plan for the river (blank) if he flat calls your turn bet? Are we going to call his push? Are we going to check behind? Are we going to push? What if the fourth heart hits and he pushes?
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