5/5 NL at Ocean's 11, interesting river...

The Bear · #1 09-10-2005, 02:01 PM

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you need to call but i wouldve pushed on the turn. $100 is way too small a bet. $60 is too small a raise on the flop as well.

who are you? i play that game sometimes.

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You want hero to bet $420 in to a $160 pot with TPTK in a spot where he can only be called by a better hand and will fold out many hands that he wants a call from? No way that's right, Mike, unless this is a very strange opponent.

Also, what size raise would you like to see on the flop? I think a large raise is pretty bad.

edtost · #2 09-10-2005, 04:06 PM

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Also, what size raise would you like to see on the flop? I think a large raise is pretty bad.

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pot-sized?

also, making a bigger raise on the flop makes getting in on the turn much easier.

That guy · #3 09-10-2005, 04:39 PM

Overbetting the flop and getting all-in on turn is far superior to calling off your chips on the river after a scare card comes...

As it played, I fold without some kind of read...

The Bear · #4 09-10-2005, 05:01 PM

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Also, what size raise would you like to see on the flop? I think a large raise is pretty bad.

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pot-sized?

also, making a bigger raise on the flop makes getting in on the turn much easier.

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Uh, why are you eager to get all your chips in with TPTK? FWIW, I think a pot-sized raise on the flop is one of the worst options. It sets you up for one or many of the following things to happen:

1) You get run off by a worse hand,
2) You get all your money in way behind or a little ahead,
3) You let slimly-drawing hands get away very cheap.

That's not good.

edtost · #5 09-10-2005, 05:13 PM

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Uh, why are you eager to get all your chips in with TPTK? FWIW, I think a pot-sized raise on the flop is one of the worst options. It sets you up for one or many of the following things to happen:

1) You get run off by a worse hand,
2) You get all your money in way behind or a little ahead,
3) You let slimly-drawing hands get away very cheap.

That's not good.

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i'm really not all that happy to be getting all my chips in w/ tptk, but i think the line i and mike proposed is better that the one taken, and gets all the $ in vs a better set of hands.

personally, i raise pot and check behind on the turn and maybe call a river bet or bet if checked to or check behind, depending on what falls and what the opp looks like.

but then again, i suck.

The Bear · #6 09-10-2005, 05:28 PM

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Uh, why are you eager to get all your chips in with TPTK? FWIW, I think a pot-sized raise on the flop is one of the worst options. It sets you up for one or many of the following things to happen:

1) You get run off by a worse hand,
2) You get all your money in way behind or a little ahead,
3) You let slimly-drawing hands get away very cheap.

That's not good.

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i'm really not all that happy to be getting all my chips in w/ tptk, but i think the line i and mike proposed is better that the one taken, and gets all the $ in vs a better set of hands.

personally, i raise pot and check behind on the turn and maybe call a river bet or bet if checked to or check behind, depending on what falls and what the opp looks like.

but then again, i suck.

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I think calling the flop is far, far superior to either line that has been mentioned.

edtost · #7 09-10-2005, 05:36 PM

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I think calling the flop is far, far superior to either line that has been mentioned.

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fair enough. i think the op's line is worse than calling, fwiw.

Kirkrrr · #8 09-11-2005, 07:22 AM

Call on the flop... honestly, that never even occurred to me, but it's not a bad line I guess.

Getting all my chips in with TPTK against an UTG raiser was not something I was looking to do. Online I would not have even bet the turn, but there I had a read and felt that I was ahead, thus the bet. Also, betting 100 into 160 pot, he's getting 1:2.6 on his call, which I think prices out any drawing hands on the turn.

Pushing the turn is horrible - he folds everything I beat and calls with everything I don't. He is not laying down AA/KK there. Probably calls with QQ, as well.

Here is something that has not been mentioned at all: what range of hands do you put the Villain on after the turn check-call? That is really the million (or, rather, the 300) dollar question.

Kirk