Wasted bet on the river?

maurile · #1 08-11-2004, 10:19 PM

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button calls, SB completes, Hero raises, UTG+1 calls, Button calls, SB calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB bets, Hero raises, UTG+1 calls, Button calls, SB 3-bets, Hero caps, UTG+1 folds, Button calls, SB calls.

Turn: (11 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, Button calls, SB calls.

River: (14 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, Button calls, SB calls.

Final Pot: 17 BB

Results in white below: 
SB shows 3s Qs (one pair, queens).
Hero shows Jh Ah (high card, ace).
Button shows 6c 5d (one pair, sixes).
Outcome: SB wins 17 BB.

Mike Gallo · #2 08-11-2004, 10:23 PM

Maurile,

By betting you give your opponents the opportunity to fold and yourself a chance to win.

If you check, you give yourself no chance. In a protected pot your river bet will most likely get called,however I would not call it a wasted bet.

tolbiny · #3 08-11-2004, 10:32 PM

what would you think about checking the turn?

Mike Gallo · #4 08-11-2004, 10:39 PM

With the intention of what, checkraising check folding or check calling?

tolbiny · #5 08-11-2004, 10:49 PM

Check calling- but mostly having it checked through as the button has done nothing but call so far there is no reason that turn card should induce a bet from him.

Mike Gallo · #6 08-11-2004, 10:59 PM

checking the turn is fine, however I like heros follow through bet on the turn.

Trix · #7 08-12-2004, 09:48 AM

You like the flop raise ?

MAxx · #8 08-12-2004, 10:02 AM

[ QUOTE ]
You like the flop raise ?

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like flop raise. Seemed to work OK this time. However, here in this spot... you don't want to knock anyone out. Sure, would like to pump the pot up a bit... but not at the expense of makeing people face a double bet right off the bat.

If you were at a loose table that peeps were regularly calling two cold, and you were convinced it would not knock people out..... then good raise.

sublime · #9 08-12-2004, 10:05 AM

I don't like flop raise. Seemed to work OK this time. However, here in this spot... you don't want to knock anyone out. Sure, would like to pump the pot up a bit... but not at the expense of makeing people face a double bet right off the bat.

The flop raise might protect your Ace outs. You have to ask yourself, is the pot big enough to be concerned about that? Its close here, I could be persuaded either way.

DrNick · #10 08-12-2004, 12:01 AM

Maurile,

Apart from the river, I like how you played the hand.

At the river, I look at from a purely mathematical standpoint: will both my opponents fold more than 1/15th of the time?

If yes, bet. If no, check and be done with it.

In the long run, I think you probably lose a small fraction of a big bet here. While it might be tactically incorrect, I might recommend making it anyways for strategic reasons (advertising, manipulating opponents, etc.)

Cheers,
DrNick