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#11
12-02-2005, 12:17 AM
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Re: Call of off-tempo push by the shortie?
[ QUOTE ]
If he had top pair, he'd check-raise me all-in. If he had a set, he'd check-raise me all in. [/ QUOTE ] We are agreed on most of this. However, he is not going to checkraise allin. How can he checkraise allin. There is more in the pot than his stack. If he had a set, he might check it, but a decent player would push with top pair. There really isn't a lot of point in trapping here. I can't believe all the people saying fold. Did they consider the stack and pot sizes? 
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#12
12-02-2005, 12:31 AM
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Re: Call of off-tempo push by the shortie?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] If he had top pair, he'd check-raise me all-in. If he had a set, he'd check-raise me all in. [/ QUOTE ] We are agreed on most of this. However, he is not going to checkraise allin. How can he checkraise allin. There is more in the pot than his stack. If he had a set, he might check it, but a decent player would push with top pair. There really isn't a lot of point in trapping here. I can't believe all the people saying fold. Did they consider the stack and pot sizes? [/ QUOTE ] Yes we mostly agree, but my point is that most preflop raisers will make a continuation bet on the flop if they hit or not. and if I miss and still bet, then he gets extra chips from me. If I miss and he pushes, I'm going to fold a hand like AQ and he gets less chips. Yea I was suprised to see all those thinking this is a fold. I scoop a LOT of chips in tournies to these out-of-tempo bets. -Scott -Scott
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#13
12-02-2005, 01:05 AM
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Re: Call of off-tempo push by the shortie?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] If he had top pair, he'd check-raise me all-in. If he had a set, he'd check-raise me all in. [/ QUOTE ] We are agreed on most of this. However, he is not going to checkraise allin. How can he checkraise allin. There is more in the pot than his stack. If he had a set, he might check it, but a decent player would push with top pair. There really isn't a lot of point in trapping here. I can't believe all the people saying fold. Did they consider the stack and pot sizes? [/ QUOTE ] Yes we mostly agree, but my point is that most preflop raisers will make a continuation bet on the flop if they hit or not. and if I miss and still bet, then he gets extra chips from me. If I miss and he pushes, I'm going to fold a hand like AQ and he gets less chips. Yea I was suprised to see all those thinking this is a fold. I scoop a LOT of chips in tournies to these out-of-tempo bets. -Scott -Scott [/ QUOTE ] Top pair is a pretty vulnerable hand. I don't see the big advantage in keeping your opponent in the hand. There is a lot already in the pot.
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#14
12-02-2005, 02:16 AM
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Re: Call of off-tempo push by the shortie?
[ QUOTE ]
This could easily be a stop and go. [/ QUOTE ] Bingo-bango! I think this is a stop and go with a low-mid PP a decent % of the time. I can remember at least a few times I have seen something similar. Generally you see this from the blinds, but it isnt out of the question. I forgot to look at the exact stack sizes, but I am adding at least a 10-15% chance we have him crushed here
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#16
12-02-2005, 02:59 AM
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Re: Call of off-tempo push by the shortie?
I'm glad that this worked out well for you.
I don't believe this to be such an easy call. I think it's incorrect to assume that if villian has a real hand he'll checkraise and if he has air he'll push. I have not tracked this number but I would venture to say that against the average villian when they push they generally have a hand. However, having said all this, if we look at your chip stack and factor in how often you'll improve your hand if your behind, plus how often you're ahead to begin with, the correct play to me at least is not real obvious. Bruce
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