AA hand

[betgo]

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t150 (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

MP2 (t2635)
MP3 (t3495)
CO (t11875)
Button (t7405)
SB (t14834)
BB (t8250)
Hero (t6945)
UTG+1 (t2690)
MP1 (t2390)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to t450</font>, <font color="#666666">4 folds</font>, CO calls t450, Button calls t450, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>.

Flop: (t1575) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t1200</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises to t2400</font>, Button folds, <font color="#CC3333">Hero ???

[betgo]

I pushed. I did analysis before that AA is not in that bad shape versus 2-pair with a 3 broadway card board, since it has set, straight and 2-pair outs.

I am really only in trouble versus AQ, TT, or JJ of likely calling hands.

However, the small reraise doesn't look good and I had 2 opponents. The fact that the board is suited might indicate a flush draw plus pair or gutshot, which I would be a little ahead of, but that might be a bigger raise.

Anyway, villain had AQ for a straight. I had a similar situation versus one opponent and a 3 broadway card flop, where I concluded I had to put the money in with AA. Maybe with 2 opponents and the minireraise, I should have layed it down.

The other thing was that I was new to the table and had raised my first hand from second position and taken my blinds. This was my second hand at the table, so I thought the UTG raise would get action, which is one reason I raised rather than limped. I wasn't sure if the late position callers had strong hands.

Maybe this is just bad luck running into a big hand. I was multitabling the 20-table SNGs and had fairly big stacks in several of them and got knocked out in various ways, so I am slightly frustrated, but it is probably par for the course.

[kuro]

I have a really hard time believing that you aren't drawing really thin to a set, flopped straight, or two pair here. I have to let it go unless my image is absolutely nuts here or villain is playing really fishy.

[betgo]

Yeh, I think I should have folded to the minireraise. The thing is, AA is about 38% versus 2-pair on this board, which would make it even with pot odds, so really I am only worried about a set of straight. I also have 20% versus a set, but only about 8% against a broadway straight. The minireraise does look more like a set or straight, since 2-pair or a strong draw might push.

I had a similar hand versus one opponent with AA and 3 broadway cards, where I checked the flop and he pushed and I folded. My analysis was that AA wasn't that weak and I probably should have lead out and should have called when he pushed to my check.

[bruce]

It's very close.

The fact that there's dead money from a folder and I think
more importantly that you have a backdoor flush draw will
probably reluctanlty entice me to call.

Bruce

I think utg you've got to check or go all-in with AA. Preferably the first. It's a standard tactic so the c/o may not have raised, but wqith AQ you'd think he'd want to know where he stands so he raises, you go all in and he has to then put you on AA and fold.
On the flop, I think you've got to lay it down because he's either protecting the str8, or is drawing to a house with trips or two pair - in either case you're beat and the best you can hope for, really, is a split.

[betgo]

[ QUOTE ]
I think utg you've got to check or go all-in with AA. Preferably the first. It's a standard tactic so the c/o may not have raised, but wqith AQ you'd think he'd want to know where he stands so he raises, you go all in and he has to then put you on AA and fold.
On the flop, I think you've got to lay it down because he's either protecting the str8, or is drawing to a house with trips or two pair - in either case you're beat and the best you can hope for, really, is a split.

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you saying I should open push with AA UTG or else limp?
Here, limping would probably have worked better, although from a results-oriented point of view, I might have still busted if CO called the limpraise depending on the size of his raise and ny reraise. I had just got to the table and raised the previous hand and took the blinds. I thought a second early position raise in a row would get action.

I am 42% against 2-pair, so with pot odds and slight folding equity, pushing would be correct knowing I was against 2 pair. Obviously in trouble versus a straight or set. Had done analysis before that AA is not bad versus one opponent with this board, but I probably should have read the action that he proablably ahd me here.

Yes, open raise all-in or check. This is my thinking:

1. You check. Any hand that's calling large raise from utg is surely re-raising (unless they put you on a slow-play), then you take them all-in. If AQ raises and then calls an all-in re-raise from utg, then they are a fool. You can still lose (I have a bitter post to this effect - pushed it all in with KK and was called with AQ and lost but, to be fair, that was in the bubble). Here only an idiot would call (I believe). You've picked up some chips, showed down a monster you've slow-played and made the table think twice about raising your calls )(which will be handing if you get 55 utg next time)
2. You raise all in. Again, only a very strong hand is calling and you have that hand dominated.
3. Any other raise - what are you hoping for? A call from a strong hand or a nut drawing hand is what you're going to get. If that hand hits the flop, you're being taken all-in and you're beaten and beaten with a holding you can't get away from easily. If he's got the str8, the best you can hope for is a split. If he's got two pair or a set, you can improve to the nut flush or nut str8 but he can improve even further to the boat.

I don't like the raise you made pre-flop in mid-stage tournament. It's crying out for exactly the sort of action you don't want. Even if the board appears harmless: 4, 8, J rainbow, and you bet out and get re-raised - is this trips? Or is it a big stack putting you on a high pair and making an easy bluff?

[betgo]

I think this is playing scared to be afraid to standard raise with AA UTG. Sometimes you will get reraised or win a nice pot postflop. Sometimes you will lose a big pot to a set or something. I think you are too afraid to risk losing a big pot.

Whether to raise or limp depends a lot on the stack sizes and how the table is playing.

I don't like making a big overbet raise that will get called/raised only by big hands, but is likely to take the blinds. I also don't like a miniraise or other real small raise that is going to be called by atleast the BB and my be reraised. However, you invite multiple callers, and it may clue people in that you have a big pair more than a standard raise or limp will.

I limp would have worked better in this case, but I really made my mistake on the flop.

Yes, I wam afraid of losing a big pot with AA. In a cash game, I NEVER slow play aces and I'm willing to lose big pots but in a tournie I want to survive and I'm happy to take the blinds rather than find myself first to act on the flop which probably won't help me (only another ace really helps bullets and then the board is usually crippled) and may break me.
In a cash game for small blinds, I'm not going all-in pre-flop from utg.

In this case, I would also limp because the blinds aren't worth stealing. But what I wouldn't want to do is make a 3-4xBB raise because it doesn't achieve anything. If you narrow it down to one caller, great. They've got a hand, you've got it dominated. But on the flop, you're in the dark and it's going to be hard to know whether they've hit until they re-raise you all-in and you're committed to the pot and telling yourself how many outs you've got (not ideal in a tournie). If you don't get a call, you've not got any advantage and you've done nothing for your table image by making the standard raise. If you go all-in from utg, at least you're confusing people.
The main problem is the post-flop play but I don't trust myself enough to make a laydown that's going to save me in this situation and, I feel, nor should you.