Preflop raise amount

This thread is not boring at all and is very important.

I think the best PFR strategy takes into account the # of limpers the starting hand your table image, the aggressiveness of your opponents, the stack sizes, and some random element.

In short there is no simple formula or rule. Just many thousands of hands of experience.

Typically 3-6 BB is my range with 4 being my standard EP (checked to) bet. If I see I'm getting too much action I'll step it up to 6 for a while.

My overall game relies on good post-flop play so I don't mind action. If you are getting chewed up post-flop, step up the PFRs, you should get less action and be better prepared for post-flop play.

[Hattifnatt]

I think the best way for 95% of the NL-players is to stick to 4bb+1bb/limper or some other formula, independing on the cards in unraised pots.

Does someone agree with that?

I disagree. I think 4bb+1bb per limper is good general rule, but I think there are a lot of things that affect it. Some people seem to think going by one particular amount always is a good policy, but I disagree.

[Hattifnatt]

Why?

I like to bet a little less with Axs (that way I'm not always losing to someone's kicker on an ace-high flop, and so that when the flush comes there are more people that might have payoff hands) and other such hands. Also I think it matters what people are willing to call. If everyone's folding to 4bb bets, then I'm not betting 4bb with AA.

[Hattifnatt]

[ QUOTE ]
I like to bet a little less with Axs (that way I'm not always losing to someone's kicker on an ace-high flop, and so that when the flush comes there are more people that might have payoff hands) and other such hands. Also I think it matters what people are willing to call. If everyone's folding to 4bb bets, then I'm not betting 4bb with AA.

[/ QUOTE ]

I almost never raise with Axs with x under T, but that's me.

The reasoning to see how much a raise people call/fold to is very very important in Tournaments (especially late when blinds are big and blindstealing is very important) but not in CG imo.

It's much more important/valuable to be consistent so observant opponents can't have a clue if you got AA or 65s, especially if you are LAG.

[Ghazban]

[ QUOTE ]
If everyone's folding to 4bb bets, then I'm changing tables.

[/ QUOTE ]
FYP

[Hattifnatt]

FYP?

Can you give some thoughts of the subject as well [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img].

[Ghazban]

FYP=Fixed Your Post

On the subject, I feel that one needs to use a raise size that works well for the game they're sitting in (obvious, yes?). If nobody will notice that you raise more with AA (and will call with trash), by all means do so.

In a more practical vein, my standard is 4BB with 0-1 limpers and 3BB+1 per limper for more limpers. In the blinds, I'll raise pot+1BB. I find this tends to have the effect I want in the games I play. Will it work for everyone? Maybe, maybe not. If it doesn't, find something that does.

As far as the evolution of that goes, I used to do a 3BB+1 method but found the BB came in more often than I wanted him to when I opened for 3BB and nobody else called so I bumped it up a little. However, raising 5BB felt wrong when there was 1 limper so only raised 4BB in that case. With more limpers, 3BB+1 seems to work well. I don't raise much out of the blinds when there are a boatload of limpers but I've found pot+1BB works better as an amount than pot did so that's what I've been using. If that changes, I'll probably tweak those amounts again.

In my opinion, the most important thing is that the raise amounts don't tell you anything about my hand. You might infer that I have a premium hand when I raise out of the blinds into a large field as I don't do it often (and you'd usually be right) but it costs you too much preflop to outdraw me (particularly as I don't automatically stack off sets with my overpairs and every once in a while, I'll show down something completely different).

I like this.