Trips reraised all-in

[WSOP Bound]

What's your line here? Is a fold weak even if you know the all-in raiser to be tight? If I'm losing I'm still drawing some outs against anything but JJ and there are good chances I'm not losing. Is this time to push or fold?



Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (9 handed)

Hero ($25.4)
MP3 ($14.55)
CO ($38.2)
Button ($23.5)
SB ($23.5)
BB ($42.34)
UTG ($54.45)
UTG+1 ($43.2)
MP1 ($23.25)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $0.25.
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls $0.50, Hero calls $0.50, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button calls $0.50, SB (poster) completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($2.50) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(5 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">SB bets $1</font>, BB folds, MP1 calls $1, Hero calls $1, Button calls $1.

Turn: ($6.50) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="CC3333">MP1 bets $2</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises to $4</font>, Button folds, SB calls $22 (All-In), MP1 folds, Hero ??????

[Sponger15SB]

[ QUOTE ]
SB checks, MP1 bets $2, Hero raises to $4, Button folds, SB calls $22 (All-In),

[/ QUOTE ]

Whoa convertor has gone crazy.

[schwza]

i can't quite tell what the action was, but i'd get all the chips in if i could. if it's JJ (or 22), so be it.

[Yads]

Good chance of JT though as well.
Edit: Although pretty poorly played JT.

[Ben]

Yawn.

Push.

[willie24]

hero calls

[GrandMaster]

Call... [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[WSOP Bound]

Thank you all for your responses. But I guess what I'm looking for is what in this scenario indicates that this is a good call. I typically play limit poker and this would be a no brainer to get as many chips in as I could, even if I thought I could lose it. This is the kind of situation that I'm finding very difficult in NL. Here my pot odds are just a bit better than 2-1 and since nobody had to pay much to get the turn there are a lot of possible holdings here. Slowplayed JJ is one possibility, JT and 22 are others. I more or less agree that a fold here is weak, but feel that it's a hole in my game that I don't understand why.

BTW....it turns out that you were all right. I did call and the river came a blank. SB showed TQ and I got the pot.

[willie24]

reasons you call:

as you said: you are getting approximately 2-1 pot odds. (it looked to me like you were slightly worse, not better, but approximations are OK here.) therefore, as long as you are going to win more than about 1/3, this is a good call.

what kind of hands might the SB have here? how many would you beat? yes hes fairly likely to have a full house but probably as likely to have any lesser trips- which is exactly what he ended up having. some players will also make this play with a low jack or a straight draw, or even nothing at all. (of course this can be a strong play if the bluffer doubts that anyone else has trips).

with these possible holdings for SB, it is likely he has a full house no more than 50% of the time, which of course makes this a very profitable call for you.

[illmatic]

You have to call here pretty much always. But everyone is missing the point. These players are ABC and they tell you what they have.

The pot was $2.50 on the turn with 5 people in, and the SB bets $1. So why is he betting $1 into $2.50 with four players to follow? What's he got?

No flush draw on the board, so he isn't trying to set a low price for his flush draw. He could do this with 8 9 or K Q or Q9. But probably he has second pair and is just betting what he got. The major point is that J-10 or a set here is not betting $1 generally right now. He flopped a monster and will usually check into this huge field and maybe then CR or smooth call. Top pair is usually potting it here also.

Now the second T falls and the SB checks when he led out last round. We know he probably does not have a set or two pair based on his action last round. It's a suspicious check and either it's "I have a weak J and I'm scared now" or "I was weakly betting my second pair and now I made my hand". Does he have a T or no? MP raises weakly saying "I have a J and I'm too much of a wus to make a manly bluff at this pot like I have a T". Now you min RR saying "I have a T". SB comes alive going crazy with the all-in.

Also, MP now folds to this all-in. If he had called the all-in, I would be less confident in my hand, since the FH is more possible now with two players apparently liking their hand a whole lot. I'd still have to call though, I think.

So the FH possibility is minimalized because 1)he bet the flop, 2)MP folded. Yeah, it's possible, but if he has JJ or 22 and played it in this weirdo way then he confused me enough to get my money. I often type: "if you got the boat so be it" and call in this situation. From his action on the first round he's more likely to have a T with an unpaired kicker vs. straight draw. There's a helluva lot of hands that would be played this way that you beat or tie. AT, KT, QT, T9, T8, KQ, Q9, 98 and only 3 real ones that you don't beat (in which case you still have 3 outs): JJ, 22, JT, T2(unlikely).

It is very very hard to fold trips with top kicker with one card to come and no flush or straight yet possible. I close to never do it.

later,
illmatic