$33 Party, QQ post flop.

[johnnybeef]

Ok, betting the flop isn't terrible, but it isn't the best line either imo.

[johnnybeef]

I think he was asking me, but I tend to fold.

[gumpzilla]

I tend to prefer betting the flop. If this player isn't tricky, do you think he's going to go through the process you presumably want him to go through of "Hmmm, guy in last position bets at pot when nobody has taken a shot, better call with my J5?" I think a T can call you, I think betting the flop can frequently slow down an A on the turn and get you a free river, and if you get popped you probably have a pretty easy fold rather than calling down later on. (EDIT: Missed the diamond draw, which does complicate things. I like the check more after seeing that, but I think I'm still usually betting. Again, if you don't think your opponents are tricky, check-call is a more expected line than check-raise for a flush draw)

The river seems like an easy check behind unless you're convinced that this guy will call with a T. Occasionally I'll bet, gambling on that possibility, but usually I'm checking.

[durron597]

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The river seems like an easy check behind unless you're convinced that this guy will call with a T. Occasionally I'll bet, gambling on that possibility, but usually I'm checking.

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Right but sometimes he calls with a T and sometimes he doesn't. But he doesn't ever have a better hand here so why not bet?

[gumpzilla]

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Right but sometimes he calls with a T and sometimes he doesn't. But he doesn't ever have a better hand here so why not bet?

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If you can bet and fold to a raise, fine. I think that a busted diamond draw or a T c/r'ing this river is less likely than a strangely played A or boat. And yes, I see people check those kinds of hands on the river hoping for a c/r more often than one might expect. It is probably the case that the likelihood that he has a T and pays you is higher than the likelihood that he has a big hand and c/r's you, but I think it's reasonably close and so I think the bet is pretty thin. I don't hate it, but most of the time I'm not doing it.

[durron597]

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If you can bet and fold to a raise, fine. I think that a busted diamond draw or a T c/r'ing this river is less likely than a strangely played A or boat.

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I disagree but I think both are so rare that it's a wash, so we should still bet.

[RobGW]

So what are you planning to do when one of them bets out on the turn? Do you just assume he missed his check raise with an A and fold? By checking behind you are inducing a bet from a hand like KT or 88. You'll be folding the best hand too often then. Or do you call down? If he does have the A and missed his check raise you are now donating money to him. By betting this flop, you'll have more info to play the hand out.
Now for the river, he's shown no strength. He has yet to make a bet. He just called PF and on the turn. Since you checked behind on the flop, he's probably thinking you don't have the A therefore his T or PP is good. Especially with 2 A's out there. If he did have an A he probably would have bet the turn. Get the value bet in on the river.

[Elektrik]

My default play in this situation is betting the flop. If C/R I let go, if called I proceed with caution. I don't mind a flop check either.

I value bet the river for a smallish amount (1/3rd - 1/2th the pot) unless OP is very aggressive, in which case I'm fine with a check.

[johnnybeef]

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So what are you planning to do when one of them bets out on the turn?

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This is highly dependent on the card that comes off, but i will likely call.

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Do you just assume he missed his check raise with an A and fold? By checking behind you are inducing a bet from a hand like KT or 88.

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Ok, so I am inducing a bluff when I am ahead.


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If he does have the A and missed his check raise you are now donating money to him.

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Ok, so I am losing less money when I am behind (as opposed to betting the flop and getting check raised.)



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By betting this flop, you'll have more info to play the hand out.

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I highly disagree. Betting this flop just adds money when you are behind, and takes it down when you are ahead. You know, there can be a hell of a lot of information in peoples bet amounts. Furthermore, I am in position, and there are cards that can improve my equity that can come off on the turn.

[johnnybeef]

This flop is one that is highly likely to have hit someone. I have position and the option to take a free card. If I bet the flop and get called or checkraised, I will likely be getting all in by the river which is not what I want to be doing when I am behind. By checking the flop, I may give a free card, but it is much more likely that I will come away from this hand with chips to spare after a showdown.