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  #211  
Old 11-16-2005, 06:29 PM
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

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Are we sure those really were his 2 next hands? The final table went on for about 13 hours. ESPN had to do some serious editing to get it down to a 2 hour show with commercials, interviews, etc. What did we actually see - 20 hands?

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It really was three consecutive hands. You can check the Card Player log to verify this. This was a rare case where what we saw on TV was probably an extremely accurate representation of what happened.

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Cool. Thanks.
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  #212  
Old 11-16-2005, 07:18 PM
B Dids B Dids is offline
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

(posted in a another thread and then "moved" into the correct one).

V Vegas wrote, rearding: "Scott Lazar's Self-Destruction at the WSOP final table"

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What was this man thinking? First he called Hachem's all-in re-raise preflop with K9 of spades and doubles him up. Then on the very next hand he raises pre-flop with QTo and calls Black's all-in re-raise (who held JJ) which eliminates him from the tournament. Did you see how fast he called Black's all-in raise? If I were Black I would have thought he had aces by the speed of his call. This was one of the worst self-destructions I've ever seen and what a horrible time to do it. Was he on tilt from the previous hand where he would have made quad aces but folded pre-flop?? I can't seem to think of any other explanation as to why he would do this..


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  #213  
Old 11-16-2005, 08:15 PM
legend42 legend42 is offline
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

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OK, my eyes must not work then. Still, the club draw heads up is unlikely, and it seems he could have extracted more money out of the situation.

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The flush draw might be unlikely headsup, but a club on the turn (even if it helps neither player) might kill his action anyway. There were also some straight draws, including a double gutter, that you can't discount given Kanter's past play.

And if you call his flop raise, then check the turn (as one poster suggested), you're going to really hate life if Kanter does check behind.

In that spot, with that much on the line, out of position against a big-stacked raiser who wants to jam this flop, I can't fault Black at all for the way he played it.
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  #214  
Old 11-16-2005, 10:26 PM
belloc belloc is offline
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

[ QUOTE ]
(posted in a another thread and then "moved" into the correct one).

V Vegas wrote, rearding: "Scott Lazar's Self-Destruction at the WSOP final table"

[ QUOTE ]

What was this man thinking? First he called Hachem's all-in re-raise preflop with K9 of spades and doubles him up. Then on the very next hand he raises pre-flop with QTo and calls Black's all-in re-raise (who held JJ) which eliminates him from the tournament. Did you see how fast he called Black's all-in raise? If I were Black I would have thought he had aces by the speed of his call. This was one of the worst self-destructions I've ever seen and what a horrible time to do it. Was he on tilt from the previous hand where he would have made quad aces but folded pre-flop?? I can't seem to think of any other explanation as to why he would do this..


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Lazar was interviewed on Rounders back in September, and he explained himself at length as to what he was thinking during his blowup. I'm not sure it excuses his play, but you can decide for yourself:

Direct link to archived radio show (.mp3 format).
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  #215  
Old 11-17-2005, 04:28 AM
jeffraider jeffraider is offline
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

Hey in the Danneman As6s hand against Black's 9h/Unknown second card hand Lon says that Danneman has A6 of Hearts when in fact he has A6 of SPADES.

OMG!

lol
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  #216  
Old 11-17-2005, 10:33 PM
HoldingFolding HoldingFolding is offline
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

Late to the party, but I just watched this hand and I think Black effectively pushed Kantor out of the hand. Kantor had TPGK, is known to get himself committed to hands unwisely and Black's telling him, both verbally & physically, I have the best hand now.

I consider this the turning point of the final table & I think Black should have got all of Kantor's chips.
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  #217  
Old 11-27-2005, 01:37 PM
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

umm... i know this is a stretch, but the Qc9c aaron kanter hand... im gonna call bullsh*t on that rabbit hunt... i think espn went through and found an 8 on any number of rabbit cams and edited it in there... i dont know if it was to make hachem look better or to make kanter look worse... but i really dont believe that hit. its extremely possible it hit... but after all the other things ive heard, as soon as they aired that i was suspect..... ?
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  #218  
Old 11-27-2005, 06:59 PM
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

I'm not buying what you're selling. It would make just as much (if not more) sense from a dramatic standpoint for ESPN to find a deuce for the rabbit cam, to show how important it was for Kanter to semi-bluff, winning w/o the best hand at the end.
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  #219  
Old 11-27-2005, 07:17 PM
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

why?
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  #220  
Old 11-27-2005, 07:25 PM
BarronVangorToth BarronVangorToth is offline
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Default Re: \"Official\" ESPN Coverage of WSOP Main Event: Final Table

The problem isn't whether they did or did not fake it -- because you can come up with a number of logical reasons why it hitting / not hitting are each "dramatic" -- so ultimately the producer is the one who decided, if it was faked, what would or wouldn't be interesting -- but the problem lies in the fact that we all know that at any given time we're not really seeing what we think we're seeing...

...so you either accept the reality as presented OR you're going to always question everything if it was "really" what he had / what would've come / what was laid-down, etc etc.

I know Paul Phillips isn't exactly the posterboy for 2+2 these days, but this is precisely the stuff he's been warning folks about for years. Ultimately ... we don't know.

So we accept or not.

Truth is, I still love Lost, even if I know it isn't real.

Barron Vangor Toth
BarronVangorToth.com
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